bp rockets

[dagabu]

You use "75:15:10 commercial BP with up too 25% red iron whistle", with a nozzle?! Again, if that's the case your 75-15-10 powder is weak, even moreso if you can add whistle and not have problems. I have never seen Steve spec using 75-15-10, hot BP with good charcoal, as a nozzled rocket on U/H tooling. He has, however, spec'd 75-15-15-10-5 + whistle (The #1 BP fuel, and the #2 Whistle Mix - hybrid fuel) as a *nozzleless* fuel.

 

Anyway, the point I was trying to make for Thunderr1 is that nozzleless rockets use a different fuel than nozzled rockets. You can't expect a fuel that works in a nozzled rocket, to work well in a nozzleless rocket. BP fuel that makes a good nozzleless rocket will generally CATO a rocket made with a nozzle. Of course, you already knew that.

 

 

It's not just me that has done this. From Baldy on Passfire, yes, they are all nozzled. I can send a link to the discussions made in 2009 and 2010 if you would like.

 

 

 

Posted 4/8/2010 12:52 PM (#105373 - in reply to #105336)

Subject: RE: Universal Tooling, Black Powder Motor Spec's

Online

Veteran

Posts: 152

Ned

I'm going to throw in my $.02 worth here. My prefered straight BP fuel for the 1# H-U

tooling is 75-15-15-10+5. The second 15 is coarse charcoal. This is one of SLD's

formulas which hasn't been mentioned yet. I use my stock BP mix, which is 75-15-10+5

dex. I make this in the ball mill. Nitrate and fuel milled seperatley for 2 hours and then

all together in the pool for 1 additional hour. I use this base BP for just about

everything. For rocket fuel I just screen in 15% 30-40 mesh charcoal for a nice tail. This

works out to about 69-13-13-9. However I don't believe the coarse coal takes place in

the reaction much. I looks like most of it burns outside the motor. I'm going to try some

made with aluminum for a tail sometime.

I've been using Western Red Cedar to make my charcoal. According to Danny Creagan.,

it is almost as quick as balsa.

This fuel is pressed to 7500#. A month ago I was at SLD's estate and we pressed up a

couple rockets on his press, (I gotta get me one of those!) and flew 'em. Steve thought

mine was pretty zippy. A later test showed my fuel to be a bit faster than his.

The upshot is, Steve's tooling can stand the hottest black powder you can make. I've got

a series of 1#'rs made up with my fuel with added hot whistle mix to test at the next

club shoot. 10%-35% whistle. I'm guessing up 30% whistle won't CATO. One at 40%

blew up last year.

Baldy

 

And Steve's quote:

 

 

Quote from Steve:

"So that's the story on that fuel. The original BP I used was 70-20-10-5 airfloat,

commercial charcoal. That make a very spicy bp rocket using the H-U tooling.

And if you want to spice it up, add some whistle to it, but then, you would have to only

use maybe 5 or 6 increments and then finish the rocket with some 60-30-10-5 BP on the

rest of the spindle, then press in a good bulkhead above that.

I granulate the fuel through a window mesh screen size after adding about 20% total

weight of the fuel with a mixture of 10% alcohol and 90 % water. I set this out in the

sun until it starts to dry out and get less sticky, and before it's too dry, I screen it again

while it is still damp. Once more through the screen now, and you have a pretty fine

mesh that mixes real good with the whistle with no bigger chunks left in the mix. The

last few batches I made, I used SGRS for the binder and used only 3%. This gives about

the same hardness as 5% dextrin."

_____________________________________________

Edited September 13, 2011 by dagabu

[californiapyro]

ok guys looks like I won't be able to enter the rocket competition... WPA just passed a rule that minors can't make can shells or rockets so, sorry guys, unless I can convince the event managers otherwise no rockets from me Edited September 14, 2011 by californiapyro

[allrocketspsl]

ok guys looks like I won't be able to enter the rocket competition... WPA just passed a rule that minors can't make can shells or rockets so, sorry guys, unless I can convince the event managers otherwise no rockets from me

 

wow to bad but if your in their club better heed there warning mate we know you would have won so not to worry keep up the good work

Edited September 14, 2011 by allrocketspsl

[allrocketspsl]

It's not just me that has done this. From Baldy on Passfire, yes, they are all nozzled. I can send a link to the discussions made in 2009 and 2010 if you would like.

 

 

 

Posted 4/8/2010 12:52 PM (#105373 - in reply to #105336)

Subject: RE: Universal Tooling, Black Powder Motor Spec's

Online

Veteran

Posts: 152

Ned

I'm going to throw in my $.02 worth here. My prefered straight BP fuel for the 1# H-U

tooling is 75-15-15-10+5. The second 15 is coarse charcoal. This is one of SLD's

formulas which hasn't been mentioned yet. I use my stock BP mix, which is 75-15-10+5

dex. I make this in the ball mill. Nitrate and fuel milled seperatley for 2 hours and then

all together in the pool for 1 additional hour. I use this base BP for just about

everything. For rocket fuel I just screen in 15% 30-40 mesh charcoal for a nice tail. This

works out to about 69-13-13-9. However I don't believe the coarse coal takes place in

the reaction much. I looks like most of it burns outside the motor. I'm going to try some

made with aluminum for a tail sometime.

I've been using Western Red Cedar to make my charcoal. According to Danny Creagan.,

it is almost as quick as balsa.

This fuel is pressed to 7500#. A month ago I was at SLD's estate and we pressed up a

couple rockets on his press, (I gotta get me one of those!) and flew 'em. Steve thought

mine was pretty zippy. A later test showed my fuel to be a bit faster than his.

The upshot is, Steve's tooling can stand the hottest black powder you can make. I've got

a series of 1#'rs made up with my fuel with added hot whistle mix to test at the next

club shoot. 10%-35% whistle. I'm guessing up 30% whistle won't CATO. One at 40%

blew up last year.

Baldy

 

And Steve's quote:

 

 

Quote from Steve:

"So that's the story on that fuel. The original BP I used was 70-20-10-5 airfloat,

commercial charcoal. That make a very spicy bp rocket using the H-U tooling.

And if you want to spice it up, add some whistle to it, but then, you would have to only

use maybe 5 or 6 increments and then finish the rocket with some 60-30-10-5 BP on the

rest of the spindle, then press in a good bulkhead above that.

I granulate the fuel through a window mesh screen size after adding about 20% total

weight of the fuel with a mixture of 10% alcohol and 90 % water. I set this out in the

sun until it starts to dry out and get less sticky, and before it's too dry, I screen it again

while it is still damp. Once more through the screen now, and you have a pretty fine

mesh that mixes real good with the whistle with no bigger chunks left in the mix. The

last few batches I made, I used SGRS for the binder and used only 3%. This gives about

the same hardness as 5% dextrin."

_____________________________________________

 

heres my 3 cents worht I prefer the DAG tooling over sld;s

[Mumbles]

They're talking about Steve's designs. If Dag's tooling is affordable, I don't know how it could be any better than Steve's. Steve's is immaculate, extremely well engineered, and almost a shame to use it.

[nater]

No offence meant for Dag, his tooling is affordable and functional - a perfect combination. He uses the spindle dimensions for U/H tooling as created and specified by Steve LaDuke, so by design, they are the same, and should give the same results.

[dagabu]

They're talking about Steve's designs. If Dag's tooling is affordable, I don't know how it could be any better than Steve's. Steve's is immaculate, extremely well engineered, and almost a shame to use it.

 

I feel the same way Mum, Steve's is the best there is hands down.

 

I copy Steve's design and try to do what he does to make it look nice as well. I am, however about 30% cheaper and have a quicker turn around time.

 

-dag

[californiapyro]

haha, i dont know if I woulda won but thanks

[PersonGuyDude]

ok guys looks like I won't be able to enter the rocket competition... WPA just passed a rule that minors can't make can shells or rockets so, sorry guys, unless I can convince the event managers otherwise no rockets from me

 

Whoa, what? For real? That sucks!

I somewhat understand rockets, those I think those fears are unbased, but can shells? What in the WORLD made them ban can shells for minors?

Did you hear this on the WPA mail list? I didn't get an email about that... Man like a week before the convention and they changed the rules

Edited September 14, 2011 by PersonGuyDude

[allrocketspsl]

I feel the same way Mum, Steve's is the best there is hands down.

 

I copy Steve's design and try to do what he does to make it look nice as well. I am, however about 30% cheaper and have a quicker turn around time.

 

-dag

 

like I said extra note it will be my first official rocket tooling since I started in this endevour now that shows you how cheap I am,or should i say frugal being that Im origianlly from Indiana and most of the family is still there and some in Illinois,how many are there!

[allrocketspsl]

No offence meant for Dag, his tooling is affordable and functional - a perfect combination. He uses the spindle dimensions for U/H tooling as created and specified by Steve LaDuke, so by design, they are the same, and should give the same results.

 

I will say he may have developed S L D his designs over time so hybrid is possible but my tooling using wood rammers aluminum hand spun on my drill press spindle and I have been making hybrid bp and half whistle for two years on mine and Im a rookie and will say my rocket fule gives me tails sometime reaching to the sky with straight as an airrow flight,it took me 6 months to get mine right and I have been told by an unknown master they are some impressive rockets,even so he wanted to come see me in south florida to check me out and my workroom! I like given the small entepenuer my biz anyday!

[californiapyro]

yt pm sent PGD

[SjeefOne]

Did a little test last night with 2 motors, 1 nozzled and 1 nozzleless. I think i'll be going with the nozzleless design!

[allrocketspsl]

Did a little test last night with 2 motors, 1 nozzled and 1 nozzleless. I think i'll be going with the nozzleless design!

 

nice rockets looked like a nozzel blow/Anway the first was a three second break!

[allrocketspsl]

Im in trouble unless I can find a new shoot site,they moved the cows to another pasture and the grass is three feet high,did a delay test hoping to shoot my three entries but no way with that much growth,safe,safe,safe.The only reason I did the test is because it had just a easter egg shell to show the delay time.Hoping tonight to shoot at a new site! Also I rammed four motors all the same and the test yielded a 4 sec delay,ooopppsss! Running out ot time!

 

 

Edited September 24, 2011 by allrocketspsl

[Thunderr1]

Nice looking tail!

[allrocketspsl]

Nice looking tail!

 

yeah i love red tails(thats the 80 mesh charcoal burning) with just a dash of spark,contacted the guy who has a site that he said will be perfect for fireworks,hes excited to watch my rockets he has a large area with a lake whopeeee! Will see tonight!!

[Thunderr1]

Sounds good. I might go put some fire in the sky myself.

[allrocketspsl]

not great but finally flew my first nozzeless,others were can shells on older rockets,15th is almost here

[allrocketspsl]

my first entry: star shell

[allrocketspsl]

entry two report

[guntoteninfadel]

ooops!

 

 

Edited October 2, 2011 by guntoteninfadel

[guntoteninfadel]

Ok, so I have my entry for the competition. None of my timing was right and I didnt have a good flight with my timed reports. Hey, I entered! I will do better next time lol.

[allrocketspsl]

Ok, so I have my entry for the competition. None of my timing was right and I didnt have a good flight with my timed reports. Hey, I entered! I will do better next time lol.

 

excellent rockets mate great work only missed by one second but wow great job,yes you did enter!Again nice rockets

[dagabu]

Good jobs everyone, no time to make pyro this fall so I get to watch you all labor in love.

 

-dag