Miech Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 The reaction is based on the reaction behaviour of magnalium, so substituting for magnesium will not work. I don't know exactly, but a feint memory tells me that it had something to do with the magnesium burning first, leaving some aluminium. Then the aluminium burns, producing a flash. I don't know exactly, it might as well be the other way around or be a completely different mechanism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonny Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 so far the most course mesh of MgAl I can get is 200 mesh and the most course Mg I can find i 60 mesh Will subbing the MgAl for Mg in this comp still let it be able to work correctly? I want to use these as star cores really. As Meich said, I don't think Mg will work at all. IIRC, if the MgAl is too fine it will not strobe, but burn as a normal star. The strobe rate can be adjusted by the size of the MgAl. Also, strobe stars cannot be properly tested on the ground as the strobe rate changes without the cooling effect of the air. I will check in Bleser's book when I get home, just to be sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyroMan LTU Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 I agree with, bonny, you need good mgal to get this strobe working as I said I'm using 40-80mesh. For those who have bleser's book, maybe can wite some more info about this composition..? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twotails Posted August 18, 2009 Share Posted August 18, 2009 why not make your own MgAl? or Hobbychemicalsuppy, might carry it, if its not on the site, email them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyroMan LTU Posted August 19, 2009 Share Posted August 19, 2009 exactly, I payd for mine 100g 6ueros or so... Making an alloy of it and corning I think would be much cheaper... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBluePyro Posted August 19, 2009 Share Posted August 19, 2009 hmm not really, I have trouble finding a good source of Mg bars/blocks. I have made MgAl before but it is too costly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonny Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 hmm not really, I have trouble finding a good source of Mg bars/blocks. I have made MgAl before but it is too costly. You can also find magnesium from salvaged equipment/parts. There are some listed under the magnalium tutorial. Some lawnmower decks and chainsaw casings are Mg. Also, many dirt bike/motorcycle etc... engine parts are magnesium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyroMan LTU Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 yeah, it is quite easy to find in old russian cars some parts of the engine block i belive is made out of mg... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBluePyro Posted August 26, 2009 Share Posted August 26, 2009 I read the notes on passfire on the formula Bleser #26 and it this is only a small part of it: '......Using finer magnalium will increase the strobe rate. Going above 300 mesh will give more of a shimmering effect than a strobe effect, due to the high flash rate.......' So it should hopefully work with some 200 mesh MgAl...if not, then thats ok, i have a few other sources to try yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyroMan LTU Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 You could try finer also, I remember zmuro or somebody else made a very atractive effect with frequently flashing strobe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firetech Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 I have heard that ballmilling D1 (without Al of course) to airfloat can ruin or decrease the effect, and that simply screening the comp is suggested. What do you guys do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KruseMissile Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 i made D1 for the first time a few weeks ago, it was a 200g batch and i ball milled it for 3 hours. And it looks like a sparkler when it burns on the ground but in the air it will most likely have a completely different effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miech Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 Milled D1 becomes a silver streamer. I just screen the composition a few times through a 80 mesh sieve, and pump with as less water as possible. Too much water destroys the effect as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pyrogeorge Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 (edited) when i made D1 i ball milled it for 40min.. and the result was excellent Edited October 18, 2009 by pyrogeorge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pogue1000 Posted October 21, 2009 Share Posted October 21, 2009 D1 (Glitter)- 53 Potassium Nitrate- 7 Sodium BiCarbonate- 4 Dextrin- 11 Charcoal (Airfloat)- 18 Sulphur- 7 Aluminum (Atomized)- 1 Boric acidThis one is note as safe because it contains a nitrate, aluminum and sodium bicarb. Adding boric acid would be pointless as it would be neutralized by the sodium bicarb. I have made many times and havent had problems. I was looking at the orginal post in this thread and I was curious what would make this "not as safe" i am not a chemist. However i am still new to all this so want to make sure to take proper safety precautions. I am just starting with some willow and TT formulas for now but i really like the glitter effect. So was curious if this was good for a "newbie" Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted October 22, 2009 Author Share Posted October 22, 2009 This formula is just fine. Aluminum and nitrates can react producing heat and some nasty gases including ammonia and Hydrogen Sulfide (think rotten eggs). In very large batches (25lbs or so) this can potentially lead to self-ignition. In the very least it is rather scary and will ruin the batch. This reaction is propagated by bases, such as sodium bicarbonate, and via producing ammonia (basic) it is self catalytic. Boric acid is added as a hydroxide scavenger to help stop the reaction before it ever starts. The best way to prevent the reaction is by dissolving it in water and using this instead of water to wet the mix. It can also be prevented by using as little water as possible, such as by pumping the stars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pogue1000 Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Which would be better D1 or one of the winokur formulas for someone learning the ropes, or is it moot point. I just see they use different chemicals! Maybe i need to master the simple wiillow, TT, Chry formulas first just looking at the future on what chemicals i might want to buy.This formula is just fine. Aluminum and nitrates can react producing heat and some nasty gases including ammonia and Hydrogen Sulfide (think rotten eggs). In very large batches (25lbs or so) this can potentially lead to self-ignition. In the very least it is rather scary and will ruin the batch. This reaction is propagated by bases, such as sodium bicarbonate, and via producing ammonia (basic) it is self catalytic. Boric acid is added as a hydroxide scavenger to help stop the reaction before it ever starts. The best way to prevent the reaction is by dissolving it in water and using this instead of water to wet the mix. It can also be prevented by using as little water as possible, such as by pumping the stars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted October 22, 2009 Author Share Posted October 22, 2009 It's all personal preference. I prefer winokur formulas over D1. D1 just looks, I don't know, dirty to me. Winokur 20 is a pretty popular one. Neither is any more difficult or easy than the other IMO. D1 probably has slightly easier to obtain chemicals, but I like winokur 20's color better. Good example of Winokur 20: D1: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firetech Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 I've seen a lot of different D1 effects based on the aluminum, milling time and the charcoal used. Some of them look like TT with delayed flashes or just flashes, or a little bit of charcoal and a bit of glitter. To me it's pretty nice, those long delayed flashes can add a bit more to the star. However I also think that the Winokurs looks a bit more sophisticated. It doesn't really matter to me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 It's all personal preference. I prefer winokur formulas over D1. D1 just looks, I don't know, dirty to me. Winokur 20 is a pretty popular one. Neither is any more difficult or easy than the other IMO. D1 probably has slightly easier to obtain chemicals, but I like winokur 20's color better. fineley some one that agrees that D1 looks like crap if you want a nice cheap gliter try ralphs glitter its nice and cheap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted October 23, 2009 Author Share Posted October 23, 2009 I've seen good and bad examples of D1. It's definitely not as good as comets. NaHCO3 glitters just don't look as good to me. I'll gladly absorb the price increase for sodium oxalate any day. Would you mind posting your glitter somewhere? I recall looking over at trueblue's site one day after a similar reference but couldn't find it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 (edited) yep sure edit " had a link but than decided just to coppy it from there onto APC so here is the new link http://www.apcforum.net/forums/index.php?s...opic=4008" edit"version 1 was an accident years ago version 2,3 i got from experimenting after reading about glitter theory and version 4 gunzaway gets credit for (he assumed optional +5%cuo/+barium crab meant both)(i have since re done the formulas so they are more clear) version 1 must not be milled (if it is for no longer than 5 min) to glitter other wise it turns into a short lived streamer here is a video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=roczkdrq73s versions 1,3 are very cheap and so are great to use as filler (or to make a ton of comets for your fireworks obsessed freinds when funds start getting low) Edited October 23, 2009 by Ralph Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunzway Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Yeah, it's a great glitter in my opinion and I recommend you all to do some testing with it and see what it looks like. In the second shell of that video, the 'silver' like stars are also Ralph's Glitter Version 1; but that's when I over milled them and you can see the effect which occurs due to that. It's still a nice effect in my opinion, but I like them when they aren't as ball milled. The aluminum used in the videos are 325mesh spherical for anyone which is interested, I might be trying 200mesh soon and see the differences there. On another note, finally got some footage of some view worthy pyro . One of the first times I've managed to get my camera and a device working at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 I use 200 mesh al these days was using 400 when I first made it seems halving the mesh size more than doubled the "pop" size Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deafaid Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 anyone tried this composition: (is a silver glitter comp.) FOUNTAIN/GERB COMPOSITION It's a passfire formula! potassium nitrate 52antimony trisulfide 14barium carbonate 10charcoal airfloat 10sulfur 7aluminum atom. 120-325 mesh 7 It's been a long time since i posted here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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