Flash powder safety

[killforfood]

Thanks for the explanation guys, this is encouraging.

I have not made any flash because it is just not within my comfort level. But this sounds like it could be safe enough for me to work with. In this case, that PTA wants to sublime when ignited is quite a handy feature. How is it with static, impact and friction? It sounds even safer than unconfined smokeless. This may sound odd but confined flash doesn't scare me near as much as the idea of making loose flash. I handle and load the salutes at the shows with respect but little or no fear. Once confined in that shell, it seems much safer to me.

I haven't seen Cracker post in quite some time. Is he still active?

 

KFF

[FlaMtnBkr]

I'm not sure why more people don't use it. I have tried to tell people about it but no one seems very interested. I have even given out quite a few samples of TPA and not sure anyone has even tried it. It works great IMO and knowing it burns slow is comforting though I still treat it like it is normal flash. I put it in a ziplock bag which probably isn't the safest container, but I know it is not going to provide confinement.

 

I'm not sure how it compares with regular flash in regards to static, impact, and friction but I would imagine it is less reactive. I put some on a steel plate and hit/scraped it with a hammer without a reaction. But I can do the same thing with 70/30 perchlorate flash and not get a reaction. Using chlorate, I can get some snaps and a lit match smell. Normal flash is not nearly as reactive as I would have thought, but just knowing how powerful the stuff is, is scary enough.

 

Yes, Cracker is still active. He has a ton of stuff for sale and is pretty busy. It might even take him a couple days to get back to an email though he just about always answers the phone. If you have ever exchanged emails he includes his phone number at the bottom. I don't think he will mind but just in case send me a message and I will give you his email.

[killforfood]

I like the "safe" flash because it lets me use any aluminum I want,

Seriously? How about 200 mesh spheroidal?

[FlaMtnBkr]

No, I should have been more clear. Any aluminum suitable for flash. It still has to be reactive enough for flash.

 

You could probably use 325 mesh spherical and add a little bit of dark flake and make your own "Blue aluminum". Maybe even your 200 mesh if it is -200 mesh all the way down to fines. I have been meaning to give that a try just out of curiosity just to see how easy it is to make.

[killforfood]

OK, I thought that was a little too good to be true. I do have a little bit of dark Aluminum but also have a few pounds of -200 spheroidal. It would certainly bring down the cost if the spheroidal could be used in the comp. I have a couple pictures that I took to determine what it was. It was a cheap unknown that I bought off of fleabay a few years ago.

 

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v236/killforfood/Pyro/SpheroidalaluminumPic2.jpg

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v236/killforfood/Pyro/SpheroidalaluminumPic3.jpg

 

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v236/killforfood/Pyro/SpheroidalaluminumPic1.jpg

 

 

Sorry about the blurry picture but that was the best my buddy's lab camera at work could manage.

[FlaMtnBkr]

Without a scale it is hard for us to determine size. But some spherical stuff actually looks like BBs when magnified. Some of that looks pretty fine and irregular shaped. I might classify that more as granular? It might be more reactive than you think?

 

I don't make a ton of flash but I have used bright flake in the past which will make a salute just as loud as anything else. Might not be as powerful but I don't care because it's just for noise. I still need to see how the TPA works with the bright flake since it can sometimes be found really cheap. I have a feeling it will work fine since once confined it actually seems to make it a little more potent.

[shouldnoteatindat]

Why is this topic not banned i could have sworn flash discussion was against the rules

[Mumbles]

Why are you worrying about it? It's not like we're unaware of this thread.

[shouldnoteatindat]

Why are you worrying about it? It's not like we're unaware of this thread.

not worried about it, just wanted to know why it was not .

[Mumbles]

Flash discussion is fine as long as it's done in an intelligent and responsible manner.

[pyroman2498]

As this is on flash I would just like to make this statement on a Al

As some of you may know blue AL is suppose to be safer, but that doesn't mean you dont treat the stuff like its not a flash powder , I just want to give the warning out to the people who think because the buy blue Al that they don't have to give care .

PS. The reason I'm posting this here is because I read some people discussing on another site, improper, unsafe ways of mixing and filling bottom shots n such with this flash .

 

Thanks

Stay safe , stay green, and KEEP YOUR HANDS !

Steven

Edited January 7, 2014 by pyroman2498

[dan999ification]

Can you elaborate on the improper unsafe ways of mixing and filling?

 

Dan.

[pyroman2498]

What i was reading was on Pyrotalk.com's forums , and they were talking about making a machine that mixes plash by stirring it , and they said sense it isnt "Shock sensitive " Ramming it !! I flipped out on their and i think it was taken down. but you could check.

[Mumbles]

That whole website is full of morons and people who are doing this hobby a great disservice.

[Maserface]

I go there when I want a good cringe, or to get the latest kewl infoz

[MrB]

Ramming flash? Um. Good. It should be encouraged, i guess. Would bring down the amount of surviving stupidity in the gene pool.

 

But something else. I read somewhere the the Chinese actually use corned flash in some cases. to this i would have two questions. Why. Slowing it down? How, pressing, and then crushing with more pressure? I'm guessing it would be harder to ignite, and i'm not to sure about burn profile.

Or is it just fiction all together?

B!

[dan999ification]

They use granulated flash in Italy for some effects aswell

 

Never tried blue probably never will, if you give the correct respect you are fine with standard al's

I agree its a bad idea to be complacent and mix mechanically.

 

I remember an incident where a drill with sparking motor was used to whisk a drum of flash.. Decapitated bodies.

And another where a drum was filled and then kicked and rolled around on dirt and gravel, similar fate.

Because it hasn't happened before does not mean it won't happen ever.

 

Dan.

[FlaMtnBkr]

I have heard of flash bring pressed into a rocket as a fuel. Not sure if it flew or not.

 

I also heard where a woman was getting the last flash out of a barrel and scrapped the bottom with the scoop and it ignited and she was killed. Would be curious to know the material of drum and scoop but it was a stupid practice regardless.

 

Then there was a guy who was screening old flash that he didn't know the composition of (if I remember correctly) and it lit. Not sure if was using something to help push it through the screen. I believe body parts were retrieved from a tree a good distance away.

 

This is a dangerous hobby but flash is probably the most powerful component we work with, the most sensitive, and the easiest to make. Good to think about so we don't lose respect for it.

 

I like the TPA 'safe' flash better than blue aluminum. I don't make cylinder shells and bottom shots yet, so I can use the binary method anywhere that blue aluminum can be used. It doesn't work (well?) in small inserts where flash needs to be mixed ahead of time. TPA flash will work for this. It's best to still treat it with respect, but it's nice knowing it burns so slow when unconfined so that if it did light somehow you can basically walk away while it burns instead of instantly burning/exploding.

[Maserface]

I really need to get some TPA

[dan999ification]

Ive seen Flash does fly in rockets, I'd never have the nerve.

There was a uk pyro ramming it in bangers believing that if compressed it would be more powerful... Stupid but he's still alive.

 

I agree that a healthy fear and respect should be kept, complacency with flash that is supposedly safe to mix will eventually lead to complacency in handling and loading the device or powder, treat it the same whether 10 or 50g "safe" or not open or closed.

 

I think the body in tree and decapitations were the same incident, electric drill. Quite a few people were killed.

I'll try to find some links if they are not here, it may have been the body farm.

 

Dan.

[Bobosan]

Ive seen Flash does fly in rockets, I'd never have the nerve.

There was a uk pyro ramming it in bangers believing that if compressed it would be more powerful... Stupid but he's still alive.

 

I agree that a healthy fear and respect should be kept, complacency with flash that is supposedly safe to mix will eventually lead to complacency in handling and loading the device or powder, treat it the same whether 10 or 50g "safe" or not open or closed.

 

I think the body in tree and decapitations were the same incident, electric drill. Quite a few people were killed.

I'll try to find some links if they are not here, it may have been the body farm.

 

Dan.

 

This accident showed up on a quick search but there are plenty more out there.

 

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1696&dat=19850625&id=PgwdAAAAIBAJ&sjid=DJgEAAAAIBAJ&pg=6849,5665436

[Nessalco]

Morbid, but here's a detailed report from the Webb Bait Farm explosion

 

http://www.jeffersonbass.com/excerpt_beyond_the_body_farm.html

 

KO

[dan999ification]

I hadn't seen that one bob thanks.

 

Yup that's it ko I couldn't post the link by phone.

after some searching i found there were more body and or limbs in trees on different occasions, sobering reading.

 

Most of the horror story's we hear are on the extreme end of the scale, combinations of stupidity and very large batches, but still a reminder of what can happen.

 

Dan.

[MWJ]

On the chemical sheet in this forum, I read that 5413 Al can react with air. Does that mean you can't even open the bag without taking the risk of ignition?

 

 

Eckart H5413 Super, 3 micron, coated. Aluminum, dark flake. German Blackhead. The undisputed king of flash aluminum. Undisputed standard of explosive compositions. An important note is that Al powder at the 3 micron level, some of the substance may be sub-micron. In that instance, it may be pyrophoric (may ignite when exposed to air).

Edited January 25, 2014 by MWJ

[Mumbles]

You'll be alright. Very fine Al is capable of reacting violently enough with air to ignite. The only time I'd be worried about 5413 is when opening a factory sealed drum. Otherwise it will have been exposed to plenty of air to mitigate the risk in storage and repackaging. I can basically guarantee you didn't get the product sealed under argon or something when buying from a reseller.