FrankRizzo Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 (edited) In a conversation with James Yawn about a decade ago, I had asked him if I could just dissolve the sugar in water first and add it as a liquid to the pan and then add the KNO3. He hadn't tried this and told me to filter the sugar water to see if I got any impurities. Boy did I! The filter completely plugged after only a cup had passed through. I used a paint filter and had better luck but there was so much crud in any sugar (I guess it could be corn starch) that I gave up filtering it through paper and settled on the paint filter. When added to the pan first and then the KNO3 was added, the whole thing was boiled down to a light caramel color and poured into grains. It was then waxed and stored. This is by far the best R-candy I have ever made and provided the only nozzle blowout I have had with this fuel. I dont do R-candy any more, too much work for too little payoff. What was your water/sugar ratio when you were doing the filtering? If you were close to saturated, the cooling effect while passing through the filter may have filled the pores in the paper with microfine sugar crystals. There's a negligible percentage of silicon dioxide (1-2%) added as a flow agent, but it shouldn't be clogging your filter quite so soon. Edited February 3, 2011 by FrankRizzo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 I had a 5:1 ration which is a little less then a 2:1 ratio. At 70° the solubility is 3.25:1 so I think I was in pretty good shape but I did add a significant of water to dilute it further at that point anticipating the crystilization at the filter mesh. I would like to try it again but that cant happen until June around here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juiceh Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 (edited) Yes, the lower the impulse, the longer the rial or guide rod. Sugar rockets need some time to pick up speed and need a guide rod that is 150% their length for stabilization, that said, some need longer rods depending on the rocket motor. If you choose to use BP or Hybrid fuel, a guide rod of only 100% the length of the body will work.Really? So for a headerless 1lb core burner BP rocket motor that is 7.5 inches long, I only need a guide stick that is 7.5 inches? Or one that hangs off the back of the motor by 7.5 inches? What about the balance the motor & stick behind the nozzle on your finger theory? I use 36 inch long 1/4 inch square dowels with about 3-4 inches of dowel attached to the motor. They are just a bit motor heavy with the balance test. They seem to fly pretty well thus far with small payloads. I'm kinda scared to cut a dowel down to 100% motor size and strap it on and fire it. I think I'll try it though! I've read that whistle rockets can get away with having really short sticks like that due to the high initial impulse. My fast BP seems to take off faster than some whistle rockets I've seen. So, it should be interesting to see! Edited February 3, 2011 by Juiceh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Really? So for a headerless 1lb core burner BP rocket motor that is 7.5 inches long, I only need a guide stick that is 7.5 inches? Or one that hangs off the back of the motor by 7.5 inches? What about the balance the motor & stick behind the nozzle on your finger theory? I use 36 inch long 1/4 inch square dowels with about 3-4 inches of dowel attached to the motor. They are just a bit motor heavy with the balance test. They seem to fly pretty well thus far with small payloads. I'm kinda scared to cut a dowel down to 100% motor size and strap it on and fire it. I think I'll try it though! I've read that whistle rockets can get away with having really short sticks like that due to the high initial impulse. My fast BP seems to take off faster than some whistle rockets I've seen too. So, it should be interesting to see! Nope, we were talking about guide rods, not stabilization sticks. A guide rod is an actual metal rod that is mounted into a launch pad or the ground, the rocket has fins on it and a little tube the the guide rod fits into. Stabilization ticks are based on flat surface and weight, the greater the weight, the more likely the stick is to follow the rocket motor, the greater the surface are, the more air grabs the surface and causes drag. I use 5/16" square sticks about 4' long for mt 3# rockets and 5/16" square 36" sticks for my 1# rockets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juiceh Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 (edited) Ahh! Like model rockets. Gotcha. I mixed up guide rods & stabilization sticks. I used to be into Estes model rockets. Still have a few of em. Their big 6ft tall "mean machine" can get away with using their 3 foot guide rod. But the weight distribution is much different. That little rocket looks pretty sweet. Are guide rod assisted fireworks rockets usually end burners or core burners? Hard to tell from the pics but is that a 1lb motor? Edited February 4, 2011 by Juiceh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 Ahh! Like model rockets. Gotcha. I mixed up guide rods & stabilization sticks. I used to be into Estes model rockets. Still have a few of em. Their big 6ft tall "mean machine" can get away with using their 3 foot guide rod. But the weight distribution is much different. That little rocket looks pretty sweet. Are guide rod assisted fireworks rockets usually end burners or core burners? Hard to tell from the pics but is that a 1lb motor? No, it's a 3# Hybrid fueled Universal Hybrid core burner. I can't say what most are since I have only used core burners but I make end burners for my model rockets. I will be trying a "different" carbon source in a 3# rocket next weekend and I hope that it makes a nice black daylight tail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WonderBoy Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 Mind sharing what your "different" carbon source is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 No way Jose!! Its a suprise, however, if you look to the East next Saturday, I just bet you well see them It was going to be this weekend but it got pushed back. Wonderboy, shoot me an email and I will tell you what I have in mind and our shoot is pretty close to you, maybe you can stop in for a beer and watch some rockets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donperry Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 Hey guys, i did recrystalization (bout 80 grams total) with KN03 and White sugar. It became dry and hard when i'm done so i placed it into a mortar and pestel and beat it to fine dust. I would then go on to ram it and core it like the guide says. Is this an ok procedure? I could not find any karo syrup at the time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anapogeetoofar Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 Add about five grams of sodium nitrate(substitute it for five grams of the potassium nitrate, so the ratio would be 60-5-35) , or three grams of propylene or ethylene glycol antifreeze, glycerin can also work if you keep the temp low. The only real purpose the corn syrup serves is to hold in water (that gives it the nice texture and re-heatability), those additives also do that quite well. Now, for whatever reason, all of those additives give a propellant with a much shorter pot life than jimmy's, and you can't re heat it, but everything else (burn rate, temp you cook it at, ETC) is the same. There's nothing wrong with ramming, but casting/molding is superior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmandotcom Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 Maybe terminology is different in your part of the world but powdered sugar = icing sugar = confectioner's sugar. There is one without corn starch, but it's not any of those three typically. yeah, in my part of the world, powdered sugar is castor sugar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 yeah, in my part of the world, powdered sugar is castor sugar your part of the world must be retarded caster sugar is a something that is meant to be constant the world over (accept from its source which varies) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donperry Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 your part of the world must be retarded caster sugar is a something that is meant to be constant the world over (accept from its source which varies) If i add a small percentage of sulphur to my 60/40 KNSU mixture, would i get any significant gain?What if i add charcoal to the 60/40 KNSU mixture? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anapogeetoofar Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 Sulfur in amounts over five percent with the ratios adjusted accordingly can almost eliminate hygroscopicity if milled fine enough, it will also give a "decent" flame. Charcoal can increase burn rate, or do almost nothing at all. Depends on how fine it is and the type of charcoal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donperry Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 Sulfur in amounts over five percent with the ratios adjusted accordingly can almost eliminate hygroscopicity if milled fine enough, it will also give a "decent" flame. Charcoal can increase burn rate, or do almost nothing at all. Depends on how fine it is and the type of charcoal. Thank you. I think sulfur might increase it a bit and also giev a more steady flame, after seeing this video. (its the second test) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 your part of the world must be retarded caster sugar is a something that is meant to be constant the world over (accept from its source which varies) Your part of the world is his part of the world, just FYI. You might want to go check that caster sugar is actually different, and not just what you think. Caster sugar is what I had in mind for the type without corn starch. It's of a grain size somewhere between grain sugar and powdered sugar. No one could confuse it for powdered sugar. It's sometimes called superfine sugar (not 10x superfine). I've found several sources for caster sugar in your country, and they're definitely not powdered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmandotcom Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 caster sugar is still finer than table sugar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 When did anyone say it was not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donperry Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 please dont spoil a good thread with a dispute over name for SUGAR! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donperry Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 So they took salt pete(r off the market in my country because someone cooked with it and poisoned some foreigners (few weeks ago).I searched my town up and down to no avail, then i head over to an farm store. And Bam! 13-00-44 Bought 25lbs of it should last me for a while Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmandotcom Posted March 21, 2011 Share Posted March 21, 2011 what sort of PNK should i look for in a fertiliser? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted March 21, 2011 Share Posted March 21, 2011 http://lmgtfy.com/?q=potassium+nitrate+npk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cookieman Posted March 21, 2011 Share Posted March 21, 2011 http://lmgtfy.com/?q...ium+nitrate+npk CLASSIC!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmandotcom Posted March 21, 2011 Share Posted March 21, 2011 good one guys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donperry Posted March 21, 2011 Share Posted March 21, 2011 (edited) Yeah, once you see 13-00-44 or 13.x-00-44.x with (x) being a decimalthen its KNO3. It normally marks Potassium nitrate on the bags as well Edited March 21, 2011 by donperry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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