Mumbles Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 IP addresses say otherwise. http://www.amateurpyro.com/forums/user/14028-bomy/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tingly Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 I have no idea who that is.. Im using a proxy so my IP is rarly what it seems. I guess help, info or whatelse is not wanted here. So i will leave the rest to a future "expert".. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrumpy Posted October 7, 2012 Author Share Posted October 7, 2012 I think you guys are being unfair to Tingley, he or she is just trying to offer an opinion, I thought that is what forums were all about.This user has no affiliation with OB whatsoever. Mumbles, "but I'm still going to reserve final judgement until I get a chance to experiment myself or see some well respected people get a chance to test it."I am more than happy to send you a sample or send a sample to someone to conduct testing on your behalf, I am obviously in the UK so if you have a trusted tester over here it would be a cheaper option for me but to settle this I'll happily send anywhere that allows this product through their border control.Just drop me a PM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Thanks for the offer. I'll ask around and see if I can find anyone over there to give it a shot. I'm not really able to do much manufacturing at the moment. I'm not trying to be mean or unfair to Tingly. It does look slightly suspicious though. Showing up as a new user just as this product seems to come on the market in the EU and only posting about blue aluminum might just be a coincidence. This combined with two allegedly different users having the same IP address, and both accounts only posting about this product raises a few more questions. I guess he/she can't take some questions about their affiliation or criticism. It's really too bad. I bet they had a lot to offer. I am however thankful for the insight they provided thus far. Any first hand accounts of it's use are great in my book, as long as it is an unbiased opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psyco_1322 Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Yes, never do that.. Specs no one knows about? Have you ever tryd to call your supplier to get data on "everything" you order? Its that simple.. The only reason i "jumpd" in the discussion is because i dont want people to get hurt from this, since its NOT like a "regular" F.. This is more like a wolf in sheepcloths that will only "burn" unconfined.. But is MORE energetic then regular F.. But i guess next time instead of giving some good advise i should tell the "ke33wls" how to blow em self up..... /edit typos/edit2, Infact, since "new ones" or "low posts" are not welcome here, i removed some info i got on this... Find out for yourselfs.. Dude, you're a k3wl...any idiot that wants to blow them self up has already watched every bomb video on youtube, you ain't got no secrets. Also, no one GAF about why you edited your post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
optimus Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Scrumpy, on 30 September 2012 - 11:52 PM, said: the feedback I am getting is incredible. Are you able to elaborate on this? Are you able to elaborate on this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mia Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 (edited) I have a PDF file for SPEChttp://www.pyrobin.com/files/Testing2.pdf Edited October 8, 2012 by Mia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tingly Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 (edited) Dude, you're a k3wl...any idiot that wants to blow them self up has already watched every bomb video on youtube, you ain't got no secrets. Also, no one GAF about why you edited your post. I watch "bomb" movies for one simple reason, to get my "thump fix". And why make something idiotic when you can watch others do it for you? Anything ground based that goes boom, is not pyro in my book.. @Scrumpy, thats the reason i left the old forum. Even tho i was not very active.. --- 3. Potassium perchlorate has a decomposition temperature of approximately 610 °C. In all trials above this temperature that did notproduce an ignition, the potassium perchlorate decomposed, leaving a residue of potassium chloride.4. Aluminum has a melting point of 660 °C. In all trials above this temperature and did not result in an ignition, the aluminum melted oncontact with the ignition surface. In several cases, a number of aluminum particles did ignite and burn in air as sparks, but withoutigniting the flash powder. Now that is odd, if i put a few g 7:3 in a pile with visco it will "burn". And leave about half behind before it dies out... (Is this even the same "Blue" you guys have in the US as the EU one? @Anyone from OB, do you have the specs/lab thing on yours?) Im going to try and see if i can film some with the crap camera i have and upload.. /edit,typos Edited October 8, 2012 by Tingly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Col Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 I have a PDF file for SPEChttp://www.pyrobin.c...es/Testing2.pdf Its all on the website: http://blue-aluminum.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tingly Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Camera refused to focus properly German next to Blue.http://www.pyrobin.com/files/IMG_1820.JPG ~3g 7:3 in a pile with 1.5mm visco going under it. http://www.pyrobin.com/files/DSCI0032.AVI Use VLC if it wont work. With a little brush i shaped the remaining F to a pile. http://www.pyrobin.com/files/IMG_1823.JPG http://www.pyrobin.com/files/IMG_1824.JPG The remaining F would not ignite from visco. I would guess it was around 1g. http://www.pyrobin.com/files/DSCI0033.AVI I cant do a "flame" test since i dont have a torch available. And the wind was kinda annoying.. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mia Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Its all on the website: http://blue-aluminum.com/ yeah i know have you spoken to john about the product? worth a mail to him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mia Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Tingly, well that is a coincidence is it not? First post and you just joined the forum yesterday. Not associated with Oliver Brown or Mia in any way are you ? Yes I for one would like to see your spec 'picture'Maybe you can copy and past it or upload the file to pyrobin. Mia your comment "Now that is interesting your quote better the devil you know try blue banish the devil" Banish the devil ! What are you suggesting? that this new Aluminium makes making flash safe? Can you show me just a single scientificaly conducted test carried out by someone with suitable qualifications showing that this mystery 'Hype Aluminium' is safer than any other for the purposes of making flash powder?You said and I quote "Ok my link to Oliver brown is a researcher for chemicals and in a way business advisor hope this helps" Well that clears that up; you work for them Surely you or Oliver Brown have a specification for the Aluminium you are selling that you can post here? You are their chemical researcher are you not? You said you are getting incredible feedback...from who? I don't see any one here on this site or anywhere else backing up your claim. I am 100% in favor of any product or manufacturing technique that makes firework manufacture safer but lets back it up with solid evidence, specs and testing by professionalsnot based on your hearsay and conjecture for a product you do not even have a spec or manufactures name for.http://www.pyrobin.com/files/contactj.jpgGive him a ring Buddy he should be able to sort out any issues you have with the product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 I've seen that data sheet before actually. That is the sort of data I was interested in seeing. It's the people involved and the people who actually did the testing who really make me somewhat question the validity of the results though. I probably have preconceived biases based on who I tend to associate with among pyro circles, but anything John Steinberg is promoting is automatically going to throw up some red flags for me. The Kosankes are not real scientists by a long shot, but they like to pretend that they are. It has nothing to do with scientific ability, but they do also regularly act as "expert" witnesses for governments and police agencies for $$$ AGAINST real pyrotechnicians. I really wouldn't be surprised if they're regularly discredited by real experts with real experience. It would also be nice if they'd give some reference to what this friction test is that they've previously published. Drop hammer tests are pretty standard across the board, but a reference or description of the tester is always good. Sample size and any confinement can lead to varying results. A 5 kg hammer seems heavy, but then again we're not exactly dealing with primary explosives here either. I only glanced through the website and the testing page, but does anyone know for certain if the Blue aluminum + GD mix they use is the 80:20 mix mentioned elsewhere on the website? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mia Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Dr Kosanke received a Doctorate in chemistry from Michigan State University, as well as Post-Doctoral studies in nuclear physics at what is now the National Superconducting Cyclotron Laboratory. He has more than 25 years working with and researching pyrotechnics, and has authored and co-authored nearly 300 articles and papers on pyrotechnics. He is a past lecturer on general chemistry at Mesa State College, has taught graduate level courses on pyrotechnic chemistry at Miami University, and is a frequent lecturer on various subjects in pyrotechnics. He is president of Pyro Labs, Inc., a small research laboratory devoted to the study of pyrotechnics and is also managing editor of the Journal Of Pyrotechnics Bonnie J. Kosanke, M.S. Ms. Kosanke graduated from Michigan State University with a Master’s of Science degree in biology. She has more than 25 years of experience working with and researching pyrotechnics and has authored and co-authored more than 200 articles and papers on pyrotechnics. She is a past lecturer on general chemistry at Mesa State College, has taught graduate level courses on pyrotechnic chemistry at Miami University, and is a frequent lecturer on various subjects in pyrotechnics. She is the founder and publisher of the Journal of Pyrotechnics, a technical journal devoted to civilian pyrotechnics.I am intrigued Mum tell me more about his standing on your side of the pond? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
optimus Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 I believe there's a fairly lengthy writeup of the Kosanke's dealings with the PGI and other backstory on rec.pyrotechnics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mia Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Thanks optimu’s I will have a Dig Around Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psyco_1322 Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Dr Kosanke received a Doctorate in chemistry from Michigan State University, as well as Post-Doctoral studies in nuclear physics at what is now the National Superconducting Cyclotron Laboratory. He has more than 25 years working with and researching pyrotechnics, and has authored and co-authored nearly 300 articles and papers on pyrotechnics. He is a past lecturer on general chemistry at Mesa State College, has taught graduate level courses on pyrotechnic chemistry at Miami University, and is a frequent lecturer on various subjects in pyrotechnics. He is president of Pyro Labs, Inc., a small research laboratory devoted to the study of pyrotechnics and is also managing editor of the Journal Of Pyrotechnics Bonnie J. Kosanke, M.S. Ms. Kosanke graduated from Michigan State University with a Master’s of Science degree in biology. She has more than 25 years of experience working with and researching pyrotechnics and has authored and co-authored more than 200 articles and papers on pyrotechnics. She is a past lecturer on general chemistry at Mesa State College, has taught graduate level courses on pyrotechnic chemistry at Miami University, and is a frequent lecturer on various subjects in pyrotechnics. She is the founder and publisher of the Journal of Pyrotechnics, a technical journal devoted to civilian pyrotechnics.I am intrigued Mum tell me more about his standing on your side of the pond? Where did you find all this out? And I'm just curious where these 500 pyro articles are laying around at? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 You have to remember that they probably publish together. So there are really only 300 total publications. I suspect a majority of them are in the Journal of Pyrotechnics. A "journal" that they own and edit as far as I know. Most would probably not regard that publication as a legitimate journal. There is a journal cataloging system that keeps track of publications and all that. This service gives him credit for 36 publications. Of which 14 are in legitimate scientific journals, proceedings, theses, etc. The other 22 are for pyrotechnic stuff. It clearly has only marginally cataloged Journal of Pyrotechnics and Pyrotechnica and none of the other publishing locations. I'd bet they also count the reprints of their stuff that appears in American Fireworks News, Pyrotechnica, the PGI bulletin, as well as the books such as Selected Pyrotechnic Publications of K.L. and B.J. Kosanke toward that 300 sort of artificially inflating the total. Ken's PhD is really more in physics, and not chemistry. His work was on the Helium-jet recoil-transport method, which is a method for studying short half-life radioactive nuclei. I don't doubt he's a very intelligent man. However, the pyrotechnic things have absolutely nothing to do with what he got his PhD in. In case you're unaware of how a PhD works, you will become an expert in your specific area and have a good understanding of your field overall, but that does not make you in anyway all around knowledgeable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
optimus Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 the feedback I am getting is incredible. Apologies for repeating myself, but are you able to give us any details? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrumpy Posted October 12, 2012 Author Share Posted October 12, 2012 Sure, the feedback from my customers has been very good, they are excited at the thought of improved safety without the loss of power or noise, this can only be seen as incredible, maybe even a revolution.As you have asked the same question 5 times in 10 days I imagine you have a strong opinion on this subject, I would be interested to hear it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlaMtnBkr Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 He probably just wanted an answer. Out of curiosity, how is it revolutionary? It sounds like it only works well in larger amounts. Binary mixing will be just as safe and should work without worrying if it will ignite or if instead you need to also mix in more reactive aluminum. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
optimus Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 Sure, the feedback from my customers has been very good, they are excited at the thought of improved safety without the loss of power or noise, this can only be seen as incredible, maybe even a revolution. I wouldn't call that 'incredible feedback', I'd call that marketing waffle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mia Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 Well you would because you’re not in the circle of testers simple! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Col Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 (edited) circle of testers? lol, that suggests any feedback will be biased.. if you want to stay in the "gang" Customer feedback without stating their credentials isnt very objective, Pc-world probably gets good/incredible customer feedback.. but its mainly from people that are not too knowledgeable about computers. Edited October 12, 2012 by Col Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlaMtnBkr Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 (edited) Still would like to know how it is anymore safe or revolutionary than binary mixing if it doesn't work well in small amounts like in a insert. Right now it just sounds like marketing if no one will say how it's “revolutionary“. Edit: I'm talking to you Mia, since you are making the claims Edited October 12, 2012 by FlaMtnBkr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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