Ball Milling FAQ

[oldguy]

Another little trick is if the hose ID is a bit small compared to the roller rod OD.

 

Bring a large pot of water to a full boil & place the hose in it for a few minutes.

 

Wearing oven mitts, remove the hose with tongs.

 

Then quickly (while the hose is hot) push, tug & massage it down the length of the rod .

 

Once both are cooled to ambient room temperature.

 

The hose will shrink & adhere to the rod like they are one solid piece.

 

(been there & done that)

 

 

[bob]

thanks I'll try this as soon as I can

bob

[taiwanluthiers]

Back in the day I used to attach a shaft of some kind to a container and use it as a ball mill. Still not sure if it was such a good idea but right now I have no idea what a rock tumbler is in Chinese (google translate is not helpful at all) so it looks like I might go with the drill method...

 

I need one because I got some Reagent grade KP that's all clumped up and need a way to break them up.

[taiwanluthiers]

Here is what I have...

 

I may or may not use the jar, as I might want to switch to a smaller jar.

 

I will attach the jar directly to a power scrubber (the motor spins slowly, and can be further controlled with a dimmer switch). I don't care about the scrubber as I have two of them and it's useless to me.

 

Here is my media, I will cut it into sections and place it into the jar. I only got this much (it weights probably about 1.5 pounds) because I thought that was enough... we'll see. I might use a smaller jar just to reduce its internal volume. I just wonder if the volume is too big is it ok to put stuff inside the jar in order to reduce its volume, like a piece of plywood for example.

 

I will only mill about 100 grams at a time anyways.

[taiwanluthiers]

 

Here is my jar with a bunch of 1/2" brass rod media... was trying to ball mill some aluminum foil and tried the drill method. It's not going to work because the bottle is too soft to support the full weight of the jar. It looks like I am going to have to build a proper mill...

Edited June 14, 2012 by taiwanluthiers

[Potassiumchlorate]

You might also buy a Lortone rock tumbler. They aren't as efficient as mills built for the purpose of ballmilling, but they will work. It just takes more time. I know one guy who uses a 3A. He mills his BP for 60 hours(!) but it works fine.

 

(I must admit that I'm a lazy bastard. I'm amazed to see how many of you guys make most things possible from scratch )

[taiwanluthiers]

I tried looking for a rock tumbler to buy in Taiwan, but I have NO idea what they are called in Chinese so therefore I can't even ask for it. When I mentioned I wanted to grind chemicals they just told me to use a grinder, which would work for non flammable or combustable stuff like herbs, but I don't want to tell everyone that I am planning on making blackpowder...

[CaptRon]

I'm making a ball grinder and I'm using a steel rod for the shafts

and I'm trying to get a rubber hose to stick to the steel so fare I've tried hot glue and poxy glue neither of them did ANYTHING

thanks

bob

 

 

Go to an auto parts store & buy some radiator or vaccum type hose that has an ID the size of the rods OD.

Should be a tight fit, that will not slip.

 

 

You want to find something that is a relatively tight fit. One trick if it's overly tight is to coat the interior with soapy water. As it dried, it will adhere very well to the rod. Automotive hose tends to be pretty good.

Ok this is my first post but here we go.

As others have said make sure your hose fit's really tight. Now here's the part that may seem counterproductive. spray WD40 on the inside of the hose and on the outside of the shaft. Being a penetrant the WD will not only lube the surfaces for easy sliding but will penetrate the metal and the rubber. then when it dries it will attach the two together almost like contact cement. I ride dirt bikes and this is how most everyone I know attaches the grips to the handlebars. I've had em stick so bad that I had to cut off old grips and buff the handlebars with a wire brush on a die grinder so I could install new ones.

[bob]

thanks for the tips guys I now have the hose working pretty good but now I having problems with the jar

bob

[dagabu]

Ok this is my first post but here we go.

As others have said make sure your hose fit's really tight. Now here's the part that may seem counterproductive. spray WD40 on the inside of the hose and on the outside of the shaft. Being a penetrant the WD will not only lube the surfaces for easy sliding but will penetrate the metal and the rubber. then when it dries it will attach the two together almost like contact cement. I ride dirt bikes and this is how most everyone I know attaches the grips to the handlebars. I've had em stick so bad that I had to cut off old grips and buff the handlebars with a wire brush on a die grinder so I could install new ones.

 

Yup, WD-40 is a thing of wonder but on long lengths, an air nozzle in a piece of PVC that will fit in the tube makes short work of fitting lengths of tube over metal rod. I built treadmills and that is how we ran 30" lengths of essentially radiator hose over the drive tubes.

 

-dag

[CaptRon]

Yup, WD-40 is a thing of wonder but on long lengths, an air nozzle in a piece of PVC that will fit in the tube makes short work of fitting lengths of tube over metal rod. I built treadmills and that is how we ran 30" lengths of essentially radiator hose over the drive tubes.

 

-dag

That's how I remove my hand grips. IF they will release from the bars.

[dynomike1]

OK since y'all talked me into buying a ball mill. Does using it take out some of the screening? Looks like on Skylighter every time you make something different you have to buy another screen.

[Algenco]

OK since y'all talked me into buying a ball mill. Does using it take out some of the screening? Looks like on Skylighter every time you make something different you have to buy another screen.

 

the only thing you should need a screen for is to seperate the comp from the media

[dynomike1]

the only thing you should need a screen for is to seperate the comp from the media

 

COOOL

[BPgorilla]

Ball mills r gr8! I just started making fireworks for the first time 3 months ago, & let me tell you the first thing I ordered was my chemicals how to make black powder. I started using a motor and pistol... the results were ok BP. so I ordered a rock tumbler, and got some marbles from my local 99¢ store, milled for 8 to 10 hours... the results were fantastic I had great fast burning BP... oh I also used pine wood for charcoal and it works fantastic!

[Mumbles]

You might want to try to find lead shot or brass rod for ball milling. Adding glass marbles is going to eventually result in chipping and contaminating your product with a friction increasing material. There is some concern that glass can produce piezoelectric sparks, but I'm not sure how much of a risk that is.

[BPgorilla]

thanks for the info mumbles..I have ordered some lead media, & am currently using it.

[northskylights]

Ive noticed that milling dramatically increased the volume powered. Just for kick is milled the components separately, weighed (15:3:2), and re-milled. Volume increased 80%. Is this normal?

[Scott2Fisher]

Ive built a few ball mills in this first year of my obsession with pyrotechnics. each time i took a short cut that bit me in the ass. this time im going to do things right and use a reliable motor, good bearing, nonslip rubber coating etc. my last task is to get the mill jar. does the shape of the mill jar affect the milling operation? i could easily get some large diameter abs pipe for the jar but i could also make an octagonal plywood jar. the octagonal jar will be more fun to make but is it worth it? also, is there any value in lift bars (like the ribs in a dryer that throw the clothes around)

[Algenco]

6" PVC works best

[dynomike1]

Also i have used lead and ceramic no comparison. I got better BP w/ceramic and doesn't seem to ware out as quick.

Ceramic wins.

[Mumbles]

Both a round plastic jar and a octagonal wooden jar can be made to work. I've never found a need for lift bars myself, but others find them useful. They can made it somewhat harder to clean if you ever plan to mill something not BP or BP components. A octagonal jar does generally run slower. I've heard reports of somewhere around 1/2 to 2/3 of the optimal speed of a round jar. The corners act like lifting bars themselves, and you apparently need to slow down the jar to prevent the media from being lifted too high. If you go this route, you might want to have a selection of pullies on hand to be able to tune the speed in better.

 

Despite the weight and potential toxicity, I still prefer lead. Brass is also reported to make nice media, though is somewhat expensive at the moment. I've used ceramic in an industrial milling setting. I'd really only trust it if it came from a known source and was preferably new. There is a lot of surplus ceramic media floating around, which can be tempting due to the low price. Others have used it with success, but it's not something that makes me entirely comfortable.

[Scott2Fisher]

thanks for the advice on the jar guys.

 

except for my first ever attempt at a ball mill, ive been using lead media. i have a friend that's big into gun collecting and competitive shooting etc. and i can get, really inexpensively, lead balls off him as he molds his own shot from collecting the lead at the end of the range.

[Poindexter]

Ok, just getting started and have some housekeeping questions. I have been reading up for several months and have made three batches of 60 grams each in the last few days.

 

What do I do with the "other" jar that came with my H-F 6# 2 jar mill? I have been using one jar to grind my charcoal, a paint brush with "fuel" written on the handle in sharpie to brush out the jar when switching to BP, and a grey handled paint brush to brush out the jar before going back to milling charcoal.

 

I was/am reserving the second jar to mill oxidizers, but it seems like I really have just a spare jar at this point. I am starting with KNO3 from the garden store and it seems to do fine without having been premilled.

 

How many sheds do I need to do this safely? My workbench is now top coated in charcoal dust. I am going to have to either replace the top and stop pyrotechnics or just dedicate my now filthy bench to pyrotechnics and get a new work bench for everything else. I am thinking something like a picnic shelter for the mill, one "place" to keep the oxidizer (maybe in the greenhosue with other fertilizers), a magazine for finished product, and the dirty workbench somewhere else near the press I don't have yet also away from the house.

 

FWIW I envision a future mill that can do about 20 kilos at a time so I can just make a bunch of powder and get on with it.

 

So 1 shed way away from everything else for the mill, shed #2 for oxidizers, shed #3 for the magazine (class 4 up to fifty pounds), and then #4 a workplace to make stars and comets and build rocket motors and so on, away from the house and all of the other three? So four outbuildings, each at least 100 feet away from each other. If I plan correctly I can take over the magazine shed for press and bench and star mill and so forth after I build an inground magazine.

 

Thankfully I have a few acres, but I don't want to go rent a skid steer and tear up the lawn without a clear plan.

[Jordan123]

Very good faq thank !