Pagoda shell construction

[Arthur]

Looking for details of "Pagoda Shells" I come across two designs, one a garnish of added ball shells that break on the way up to the main burst, the other design is some double ended single shot comet candles attached to a ball shell, again firing during the rise of the main shell.

 

Does anyone have a definition of a pagoda shell, is either of the above likely? Has anyone seen a turorial video on youtube or the like?

 

I'd love to see construction pictures etc.

[pyrojig]

I believe Truebluepyro posted a video of the shell you describe in the shell competition page. It is a video, but he also posted in other threads the pictures of the shell, and details on construction. Try searching under a diff. name than Pagoda shell. Maybe under rising tail, dragons tail,

Another member on the pyroguideforum made this shell as well. His name is BJV. It is on pg 4 on the Pattern shells thread.

 

http://www.pyroguideforum.com/

Edited October 13, 2012 by pyrojig

[Mumbles]

I've never heard of the term pagota shell either. The type of effects you describe are covered in Shimizu's FAST. I've always heard them called ascending effects or Kyoku-do. If I want to be more specific, I call the small shells "rising flowers", or the single shot candles "rising spliting comets". I've made many shells with rising flowers, and one with the rising splitting comets. Shimizu actually describes another variation where the single shot candles actually have small shells inside of them. I'd imagine this would only be viable for rather large shells. Rising flowers are pretty much what they seem. Smaller shells attached to the lift loop on the main shell. I prefer to time them in regular intervals, but that's personal preference. I generally leave them loose on top of the shell, but some people recommend securing them down with a strip of pasted paper or tape. I can describe the splitting comets too if you want, but it's a little more involved, and I don't really know how to describe the attachment.

 

Seymour has some nice pictures of these sorts of effects in his gallery. http://www.amateurpyro.com/forums/gallery/album/75-seymours-gallery/

[fredhappy]

#arthur:

 

http://youtu.be/0Mn-UKU27s4?hd=1

 

4"kamuro with 2x19.7mm kyoku do bismuth crackling matrix comets

 

These are the so called splitting comets.

 

 

http://youtu.be/J7Z361_GSkM?hd=1

 

6"glitter bowtie with strobe petal,violet to red ring, with 7x2"rising shells and 2"red comet.

 

These are the rising shells. The timings for the rising shells were a bit late, but the shell turned out ok.

 

I hope this clarifies the difference a bit for you.

 

#mumbles : since you say you've shot many of these shells with rising flowers, do you have any clips of these ? I'd be interested how they turned out.It's always nice to see some clips and see other peoples timings on rising effects.

Edited October 14, 2012 by fredhappy

[Mumbles]

I'll take a look, but I don't think so. Getting shells on video is a great learning tool, but it's hard to hand light at club events and also videotape them, so I have to rely on the kindness of others. I've been making more cylinders as of late, but I'll be sure to get them on video in the future.

[psyco_1322]

#arthur:

 

http://youtu.be/0Mn-UKU27s4?hd=1

 

4"kamuro with 2x19.7mm kyoku do bismuth crackling matrix comets

 

These are the so called splitting comets.

 

 

http://youtu.be/J7Z361_GSkM?hd=1

 

6"glitter bowtie with strobe petal,violet to red ring, with 7x2"rising shells and 2"red comet.

...

 

OT, but those were some very nice shells! I thought for sure the 4" was a commercial shell until I read the description.

[burningRNX]

Here is a video of an 6" willow diadem with added splitting comets and red and silver insert.

Its basically 6 tubes with timefuse in the middle and 2 comets per tube at the end fired by BP or pulverone.

you can build one beforehand and slide it over an dragrope and secure with hotglue.

You have to make sure that the ends have no gas leaks and open easely.

[fredhappy]

#psycho: Thank you kindly for your words. I was quite pleased at both shells, although the fallout from the 4"was too much due to the fact that I only screened the kamuro mix ( no milling).

 

The rising shells on the 6"er were timed too late, so the last rising effects blended in with the bowtie, but it was still very pleasing to watch.

 

#burning RNX: that picture looks just downright beautiful man..very nicely crafted..

 

Below is a picture of the two rising crackling kyoku do's on the 4'er. It was a bit of a challenge to make them fit, but it turned out ok.

Edited October 14, 2012 by fredhappy

[burningRNX]

Thanks Fred, your shells are an pleasure to watch, lot of work is in there.

I found another picture revealing the central tube:

[Mumbles]

BurningRDX, did something happen on the lift? It looked like one of the inserts went off in the tube or the comet got blown off or something like that. It was a good looking shell though.

 

I do my best to avoid hot glue in the preparation of fireworks. Although that is how I actually attached my one live attempt at this effect, I have been trying to figure out the method diagrammed in Shimizu. It uses a paper tube down the center of the split comet units, and something about an iron wire.

[burningRNX]

I added some left over stars to the lift bag, something I did occasionally, sometimes with added Ti turnings.

These were better pearl stars.

 

About the iron wire, this is what I thought:

splitcomets.bmp

 

Edit: you have to wind it up until the windings reach the loop, maybey more wires are needed than just one.

Edited October 14, 2012 by burningRNX

[Mumbles]

That makes a lot of sense. The image in Shimizu isn't particularly clear.

[fredhappy]

#mumbles: "I do my best to avoid hot glue in the preparation of fireworks"

Why if I may ask? For the kuyoku do's on the 4"er the string method would be too elaborate and not necessary. The examples in FAST are all for larger caliber shells as far as I remember. Not to mention that the book was written in the 1960's. I am sure the good Dr would have had no qualms in using hotglue.Not saying that I don't like the look of those nicely crafted shells like burningrnx and BJV's....

 

 

I do my best to avoid the use of metal objects in the preparation of fireworks..hehe..

Edited October 15, 2012 by fredhappy

[Mumbles]

I agree that solid metal objects in pyro aren't particularly good either. I like the look of burningRDX's shell where it's secured to a thick rope.

 

I just don't particularly like hot glue, though do use it for a few select applications. It's always in combination with some other reinforcement or fireproofing barrier though. My aversion to it probably has a lot to do with it's excessive use in poor quality youtube tutorials. It's just used as a shortcut and cop out for proper techniques or materials too often. In my opinion, too much hot glue makes shells look cheap and more likely to be low quality. If someone is proud enough of their work that they are willing to take the time and effort to make sure the components and exterior look professional, they are likely to also take the effort to ensure the effect is just as nice. That is certainly not to say that hot glue will preclude a good effect.

[fredhappy]

#mumbles : I understand your opinion. I agree with you on the crappy youtube tutorials and sometimes cheap looks from an abundance of hotglue.

 

I have to confess I am always a bit sloppy with the exterior. I am often impatient and want to shoot a.s.a.p when I finish pasting my shells. I do try to go the extra mile with precision star rolling and dialing in my break configurations though....

 

Again, burningrnx shell looks so good, it's almost a shame to light it.

 

For rising 2"shells I always try to make it look nice by using hemp rope , and add some extra pasting on top of the rope to make it look good.

Edited October 15, 2012 by fredhappy

[AirCowPeacock]

Think I could effectively fit splitting comets (or mines) on a 3" shell?

[Mumbles]

Where there's a will, there's a way.

[Arthur]

With lots of additions my issue is ensuring that the garnish items rise far enough to function safely above the crowd while still being separate from the main break. Timing is I suppose the key.

[AirCowPeacock]

Its travelling the fastest when it leaves the morter. For small flowers think of it this way: "What time would I normally put on a shell this size." Since a larger shell probably travels faster inorder to reach a greater hight, you could probably cut 15-30% off that. With splitting comets, I guess its not quite as simple.

[burningRNX]

I normally start with timings at about 1,5 - 1,7 seconds from lift off.

I think the timing of that shell was 1,5 - 2,2 - 2,8 - 3,3 - 3,7 - 4 sec, and burst at 4,5 sec.