Zumber Posted July 11 Posted July 11 Ferric sulphide or Iron[3] sulphide is not stable at room temperature and decomposes at ambient temperature Iron [2] sulphide or ferrous sulphide have successfully used here. It can be useful in glitter mixture, it is commercially produced and sold here for glitter effect.
Chandan123 Posted July 12 Posted July 12 22 hours ago, Zumber said: I have not tried anything. I am hobbyist person, I have no chemicals right now. May be I will give a try later. Ok
Rohan8858 Posted July 12 Posted July 12 Chandan123 I did not get the same result in the first I want using Modified Troy Fish Glitter Composition
Chandan123 Posted July 13 Posted July 13 11 hours ago, Rohan8858 said: व्हिडिओ-२०२५०७१२-WA००६६.mp4 sorry to say brother but ur video is not accesible it is not opening .
Norsepyro Posted July 13 Author Posted July 13 (edited) 1 hour ago, Rohan8858 said: व्हिडिओ-२०२५०७१२-WA००६६.mp4 Is this the modified fish glitter? The tail length is nice but seem to lack the defined glitter pops. Maybe your aluminium is too coarse? Atomized 325 mesh or preferably 400 mesh works best in my experience. Edited July 13 by Norsepyro
Rohan8858 Posted July 13 Posted July 13 I have used atomized alluminium 325 mesh but still I did not gate the glitter effect.
Chandan123 Posted July 13 Posted July 13 3 hours ago, Rohan8858 said: व्हिडिओ-२०२५०७१२-WA००६६.mp4 It is burning very fast; I think you mixed all the ingredients together. By the way, the lift was good, can u tell which lift and amount of lift?
Norsepyro Posted July 13 Author Posted July 13 1 hour ago, Rohan8858 said: I have used atomized alluminium 325 mesh but still I did not gate the glitter effect. Have you used this aluminium successfully in any other glitter formulae? From the video it does not seem to work very well for glitter. I would try another type of atomised if you can get it. Mine is - 400 mesh with average particle size 10-20 micron and works well in several glitter formulae. Charcoal type can also affect the glitter effect but I think the aluminium type is the most important variable.
Zumber Posted July 13 Posted July 13 1 hour ago, Norsepyro said: Have you used this aluminium successfully in any other glitter formulae? From the video it does not seem to work very well for glitter. I would try another type of atomised if you can get it. Mine is - 400 mesh with average particle size 10-20 micron and works well in several glitter formulae. Charcoal type can also affect the glitter effect but I think the aluminium type is the most important variable. I have seen many glitter formulas which mensions 12 micron atomized aluminum. That would be approximately 1200 mesh. please guide me more on this. He has used -325 mesh atomized aluminum and this is the only finer mesh atomized aluminum available here. I just have checked suppliers data sheet. Finer than 400 mesh is not mentioned under atomized aluminum category. This mircon to mesh conversion created confusion for me which aluminum would be correct for the glitter effect. Finer grades are mentioned to be useful for noise production here. Apart from this discussion, glitter needs to be prepared correctly and dried correctly. Excess water destroys metals fuels. Temperatures also promotes this phenomenon so glitter should be processed with minimum water and dried in a shade instead of direct sunlight. Pressed stars would be good choice. I just cant go in detail as glitter star process information is readily available on this forum,websites.... He might have not followed this special preparation method besides proper mesh aluminum.
Norsepyro Posted July 13 Author Posted July 13 49 minutes ago, Zumber said: I have seen many glitter formulas which mensions 12 micron atomized aluminum. That would be approximately 1200 mesh. please guide me more on this. He has used -325 mesh atomized aluminum and this is the only finer mesh atomized aluminum available here. I just have checked suppliers data sheet. Finer than 400 mesh is not mentioned under atomized aluminum category. This mircon to mesh conversion created confusion for me which aluminum would be correct for the glitter effect. Finer grades are mentioned to be useful for noise production here. Apart from this discussion, glitter needs to be prepared correctly and dried correctly. Excess water destroys metals fuels. Temperatures also promotes this phenomenon so glitter should be processed with minimum water and dried in a shade instead of direct sunlight. Pressed stars would be good choice. I just cant go in detail as glitter star process information is readily available on this forum,websites.... He might have not followed this special preparation method besides proper mesh aluminum. Common atomized aluminium grades sold as 325 mesh or 400 mesh usually means that all or most particles will pass the specified screen size. However the average particle size will usually be much smaller. The distribution of particles will then be in the range from 0 micron to 37 micron for 400 mesh, with an average likely between 10-20 micron. However what is sold as a certain size by resellers may not always be correctly advertised either, the only way to know the size for sure is to have the manufacturers specifications, or measure the particle size with a microscope. I have read that a 2-3 micron average particle size atomized aluminium is very useful for flash compositions. Coarser grades work too but are better mixed with some finer grades.
Pyroboy Posted July 14 Posted July 14 (edited) On 7/11/2025 at 4:28 PM, Zumber said: Ferric sulphide or Iron[3] sulphide is not stable at room temperature and decomposes at ambient temperature Iron [2] sulphide or ferrous sulphide have successfully used here. It can be useful in glitter mixture, it is commercially produced and sold here for glitter effect. Your are totally right, I ment iron (II)-sulfide! But that does not change the way the iron itself behaves in the muixture, beside maybe working as oxidizing agent in some way. Did you get better results in using the sulfide instead of sulfur and e.g. red or black ironoxide? For the aluminium, I head best results with <65µm (-230 mesh) spattered (irregular shaped, normally used as filler for epoxy resin) or with <45µm (-325 mesh) atomised powder. The glitter for the second shell of following video is with the <65µm aluminium: https://vimeo.com/260494844?p=1s Smaller aluminium might work as well, but with somewhat larger (45 - 70µm) you will get better results in most compositions. Edited July 14 by Pyroboy
Mumbles Posted July 14 Posted July 14 If you want a more pronounced longer glittery or flashy delay, you'll want to go with coarser aluminum not finer. Think something like this: https://www.fireworkscookbook.com/product/aluminum-atomized-alcoa-120/ Most of the original glitters and basically all of the Winokur glitters were formulated using Reynolds 120 aluminum, which is similar to the above product. I think something has been lost with most people using substantially finer atomized aluminums available now. Some of the Winokur ones in particular really lose out when that coarser component is not present. Coarse components in glitter compositions can really lengthen the delay before the flash. You may want to consider adding in a small amount of coarser MgAl, 80 mesh charcoal, or a proportion of non-ballmilled nitrate.
Zumber Posted July 15 Posted July 15 18 hours ago, Pyroboy said: Your are totally right, I ment iron (II)-sulfide! But that does not change the way the iron itself behaves in the muixture, beside maybe working as oxidizing agent in some way. Did you get better results in using the sulfide instead of sulfur and e.g. red or black ironoxide? For the aluminium, I head best results with <65µm (-230 mesh) spattered (irregular shaped, normally used as filler for epoxy resin) or with <45µm (-325 mesh) atomised powder. The glitter for the second shell of following video is with the <65µm aluminium: https://vimeo.com/260494844?p=1s Smaller aluminium might work as well, but with somewhat larger (45 - 70µm) you will get better results in most compositions. Can you mention composition of stars shown in video? Also how the stars is processed, dried? i. e. Amount of water alcohol, pressed or rolled, method of drying ( in front of fan, over screen in shadow etc.)
Zumber Posted July 15 Posted July 15 (edited) DU10.pdfDU10.pdf 15 hours ago, Mumbles said: If you want a more pronounced longer glittery or flashy delay, you'll want to go with coarser aluminum not finer. Think something like this: https://www.fireworkscookbook.com/product/aluminum-atomized-alcoa-120/ Most of the original glitters and basically all of the Winokur glitters were formulated using Reynolds 120 aluminum, which is similar to the above product. I think something has been lost with most people using substantially finer atomized aluminums available now. Some of the Winokur ones in particular really lose out when that coarser component is not present. Coarse components in glitter compositions can really lengthen the delay before the flash. You may want to consider adding in a small amount of coarser MgAl, 80 mesh charcoal, or a proportion of non-ballmilled nitrate. Can you check data sheet attatched below and suggest if it will work or not? The place and country where we live only have access to this atomized aluminum. Edited July 15 by Zumber
Norsepyro Posted July 15 Author Posted July 15 I think the specifications for that atomized aluminium seem like a good size for glitter effects, it should be something like mostly sub 350 mesh according to specifications. But the ultimate test is always to try it in a star recipe so I would only get a small sample first. Not all glitter formulas work equally good with the same size aluminium either. Winokur mentions a fine atomized grade which gave exceptional results in one gold glitter mix(KNO3, charcoal, sulfur, Sb2S3 NaHCO3, atomized al) , but was inferior to coarser grades in some of the white glitter mixes, nr 31-38. The coarser atomized aluminium grades seemed to give more dross and downfall in some of the sodium bicarbonate mixes, according to Winokur.
Zumber Posted July 15 Posted July 15 1 hour ago, Norsepyro said: I think the specifications for that atomized aluminium seem like a good size for glitter effects, it should be something like mostly sub 350 mesh according to specifications. But the ultimate test is always to try it in a star recipe so I would only get a small sample first. Not all glitter formulas work equally good with the same size aluminium either. Winokur mentions a fine atomized grade which gave exceptional results in one gold glitter mix(KNO3, charcoal, sulfur, Sb2S3 NaHCO3, atomized al) , but was inferior to coarser grades in some of the white glitter mixes, nr 31-38. The coarser atomized aluminium grades seemed to give more dross and downfall in some of the sodium bicarbonate mixes, according to Winokur. Thank you. I am gonna give a try with small batch.
Pyroboy Posted July 15 Posted July 15 4 hours ago, Zumber said: Can you mention composition of stars shown in video? Also how the stars is processed, dried? i. e. Amount of water alcohol, pressed or rolled, method of drying ( in front of fan, over screen in shadow etc.) Yes, it is, as mentioned above, a 1:1 mixture of Winokur 20 and D1 Glitter mixture. But I use only aluminium not MgAl. In sum it ist as follwowed: 50.5 KNO3 17.5 S 10.5 C 9.5 Al (<65µm, irregular shaped) 6.5 NaHCO3 2 Fe2O3 4 Dex Bound with 10 weight-% water / ethanol - mixture (80% : 20%). In case of the 5" shell I used 19 mm pumped stars without a prime.
Pyroboy Posted July 15 Posted July 15 Yes I did, but just used them as 5mm Cores for TT or Willow Stars. Then it gives more like a "gold strobe" Tip. But its definetly possible to roll them. Due to the high density of the ironoxide they roll preatty well.
Zumber Posted July 16 Posted July 16 6 hours ago, Pyroboy said: Yes I did, but just used them as 5mm Cores for TT or Willow Stars. Then it gives more like a "gold strobe" Tip. But its definetly possible to roll them. Due to the high density of the ironoxide they roll preatty well. Thanks I was worried about excess water that might kill glitter effect during rolling stars.
Norsepyro Posted July 20 Author Posted July 20 On 7/14/2025 at 5:23 PM, Pyroboy said: Your are totally right, I ment iron (II)-sulfide! But that does not change the way the iron itself behaves in the muixture, beside maybe working as oxidizing agent in some way. Did you get better results in using the sulfide instead of sulfur and e.g. red or black ironoxide? For the aluminium, I head best results with <65µm (-230 mesh) spattered (irregular shaped, normally used as filler for epoxy resin) or with <45µm (-325 mesh) atomised powder. The glitter for the second shell of following video is with the <65µm aluminium: https://vimeo.com/260494844?p=1s Smaller aluminium might work as well, but with somewhat larger (45 - 70µm) you will get better results in most compositions. That is a stunning glitter, thanks for sharing! As for the discussion of fine vs. coarse atomized aluminium, I came to think of a test I did with some -200 mesh and -400 mesh I used in the D1 glitter formula. The 200 mesh glittered nicely with good tail, while the - 400 mesh glittered with a very short tail, maybe not unexpectedly. However in another white glitter formula with less sulfur and around 12% Sb2S3 the - 200 mesh completely failed to glitter while the - 400 mesh glittered nicely. My conclusion is that the coarser atomized aluminiums (-150/-200/-250 mesh) seem to work very well in the higher sulfur formula (usually with 15-18% sulfur) and with sodium bicarbonate or oxalate, while the finer grades usually work better in mixtures with more Sb2S3 or other delay mechanisms. The high sulfur mixes may burn too hot for creating a good delay with small particles, but perfectly hot to give a flash from larger particles. You can of course mix your aluminiums too to get the desired effect. Adding +3-4% coarse Al or MgAl (30-100 mesh) has worked for me in some short delay high sulfur formulae.
Zumber Posted Monday at 12:38 PM Posted Monday at 12:38 PM Rumour has been spread out here that you should not use Ferrous Sulphide and sulphur together in glitter composition. It may het up composition in presence of water. Many people's who make this glittering effect with charcoal tail are saying this statement. I need technical answer, is it rumour?
Pyroboy Posted 4 hours ago Posted 4 hours ago Hm...my only suggestion is that if the sulfur contains small amounts of acid it reacts with the Fe(II)S forming H2S, which as an acid itself reacts easily with the Al or MgAl. But most components as oxalate or hydrogencarbonate are basic, so it would prohibit such a reaction. Sorry I do not have an explanation for it. It seems to me unlikely that it does not work together.
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