Sodium Oxalate vs Bicarbonate in Glitter

[AzoMittle]

Are Sodium oxalate and Sodium bicarbonate exchangeable in glitter formulations? I'm looking at things like Winokur and D1.

 

They both seem to play the role of retardant and yellow color agent. What is the difference between them? Why use one or the other?

 

Thank you,

 

AzoMittle

[schroedinger]

In glitters ether sodium carbonate or atimony trisulfide is used to give an delay instead of instantly burning the aluminium, this way the glitter effect is achieved. For more i can recommend L.Scott Oglesby Glitter-Chemistry & Technics

[nater]

Show us a glitter comp which uses antimony trisulfide for the delay.

[MrB]

Crazy_Swede Glitter

- 51 KNO3

- 10 Ba(NO3)2

- 12 Charcoal (Passed through 80-mesh sieve)

- 10 Atomised Al (Not too fine)

- 8 Sulfur

- 8 Sb2S3 (Antimony trisulphide)

- 6 Fe2O3 (Red iron oxide)

- 5 Dextrin

This is a glitter Crazy_Swede posted. I havent got around to trying yet because I have no antimony.

 

I got a bunch of strobes and glitters in my collection of formulas that use antimony... Nothing that i've tested.

B!

[AzoMittle]

I actually own Oglesby's Glitter book, I haven't read it yet though. Great book, very detailed.

 

MrB, there are tons of glitter that use Antimony, I don't think that is what Nater meant. I think he meant that it is not used as a delay, that it plays some other role.

 

In practice and theory though, what is the difference between Sodium (bi)carbonate and Sodium oxalate? Can I replace the bicarbonate with oxalate and vice versa?

[schroedinger]

If you own that book, just have a look at p 31 to answer your question.

 

The antimony question is also answerd in that book.

 

Generally it lowers the viscosity of the molten phase, forming polysulphides which generate pottasium sulphides in the high temperatur (and some other effects) and coat the antimony onto the aluminium particles. From there the glitter effect starts, by first burning of the antimony and leaving the aluminium burning outside of the hot phase of the oxidizer rich star itself. (For a really god and very detailed research about this effect read the book mentioned above).

[Mumbles]

Show us a glitter comp which uses antimony trisulfide for the delay.

 

Winokur 39. It has both antimony trisulfide and barium carbonate which act together to form the delay in this particular formula. What happens physically during the effect is unclear, but it's clear that the antimony plays a major role in generating the delay, even if it only is in there to ultimately spit out sulfur.

 

As far as sodium bicarbonate vs. sodium oxalate. The effect is similar. They can generally be interchanged while retaining the general effect. I prefer oxalate personally. In my opinion it tends to give a nicer color and somewhat nicer effect. I've never really done side by side comparisons of the two chemicals in the same formula, so I can't speak to that. NaHCO3 formulas seem to have a bit more fallout from what I've tried, but also tends to give a somewhat longer delay.