PyroAce Posted June 16, 2012 Share Posted June 16, 2012 Has anyone here ever pulled apart a roman candle (any variety) made by the Chinese? How are they constructed because they seem to be able to make these items so cheaply, I know they don't use any candle composition as a delay in between shots like the older ones made in the USA and Britain, so what replaces this, sawdust I am guessing? My guess would be that they run a piece of visco fuse the whole way down the candle, there is a clay plug at thge bottom, on top of this goes some lift powder, then the star, then saw dust and rammed? Then the next lift, star and sawdust charge goes on top and so on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nater Posted June 16, 2012 Share Posted June 16, 2012 (edited) Yes. Sawdust in between shots. Visco for the delay. Some have inserts just like cakes with a small lift charge and a primed visco time fuse. Edited June 16, 2012 by nater Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted June 16, 2012 Share Posted June 16, 2012 (edited) They are also pretty easy to make, use an oak rammer slightly smaller then the tube ID to press the sawdust plugs. As you can see below, the plugs are not perfect, the ones on top are deeper and the ones on the bottom are pretty short. You can roll tubes from sheets of chipboard that are used for pallet pads, roll the tube on a dowel about 1/8" larger than the stars you want to use. Lift powder can vary but 10% seems to work well for most stars. I found pressed stars to work better round stars as they lift better. Also, making a display candle is a lot of fun, 1" crossettes are a blast to use. Edited June 16, 2012 by dagabu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graumann Posted June 16, 2012 Share Posted June 16, 2012 Sorry dag I can't really see from the first pic, is that granulated lift under what looks to be cardboard cups or on top of them? As in star, lift, cup, sawdust. This looks much easier than what I have been doing which is cutting the tube, ramming delay, lift, lift disk, star and then glue the segments back together and rolling a few layers over the join. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyroAce Posted June 17, 2012 Author Share Posted June 17, 2012 Thanks for the replies That's exactly what I was after dagabu. Thanks Do you think the saw dust is slightly moistened? And how hard should it be rammed, don't want to break the stars. I love this method because it is so cheap and quick and you get very good results. It just goes to show how cheap the Chinese produce these things, must work out to 5 cents per Roman Candle going on labour costs and material savings, look how cheap they can be imported for with $USD. Does anyone know how much a case of basic 7 shot colour Roman Candles costs wholesale? Would be very interesting. graumann I know this method, it's on Passfire correct? I think the main reason the Roman Candle is constructed in segments is for consistency, because each shot is measured, they rise to the almost exact same height. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nater Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 (edited) I think the sawdust is lightly tamped dry. The ones I had crumbled easily when the candle casing was cut open, so they weren't packed too tight. Most likely, just tamped solid enough to provide a fire block and to avoid packing the lift charge or cracking the star. The method of constructing a candle by individual shots is buried in the Passfire forums by Gary Smith, but the methods in the article section are more traditional. Skylighter has a good tutorial on this technique, and might be what you were thinking of. Here are a few pictures of the inserts of another consumer candle: Edited June 17, 2012 by nater Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyroAce Posted June 17, 2012 Author Share Posted June 17, 2012 Thanks nater! Are those flash reports? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nater Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 Thanks nater! Are those flash reports? No, quite the opposite. It is a so-called "jellyfish" effect. Each insert has 3 pieces of falling leaves fuse as is shown in the picture. The insert pops open and the bits of fuse spiral down. Very simple effect when you see how it was done. The breaks are from something else during open shooting, this candle is quiet. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGB97qO3U8E Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Thanks for the replies That's exactly what I was after dagabu. Thanks Do you think the saw dust is slightly moistened? And how hard should it be rammed, don't want to break the stars. I love this method because it is so cheap and quick and you get very good results. No, the saw dust is dry and I tamp them with an 8oz. plastic hammer, four light strokes each. There is no way you can crush a star doing this, the saw dust acts as a shock absorber. I found that the most important thing to do is to use a kraft paper disk over each star or insert before adding the saw dust. It just goes to show how cheap the Chinese produce these things, must work out to 5 cents per Roman Candle going on labour costs and material savings, look how cheap they can be imported for with $USD. Does anyone know how much a case of basic 7 shot colour Roman Candles costs wholesale? Would be very interesting. About $80.00 for a case of Pyro Paint Ball, 21 packs of ten candles. Expect to pay about $.15 each candle for the cheaper ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyroAce Posted June 19, 2012 Author Share Posted June 19, 2012 Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted June 19, 2012 Share Posted June 19, 2012 (edited) Would anybody be interested in a roman candle class at PGI? I can show how I make mine and I am working with a buddy on a surprise insert that has never been shot from a candle before! -dag Edited June 19, 2012 by dagabu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
californiapyro Posted June 19, 2012 Share Posted June 19, 2012 definitely! now to join PGI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyroLearner1989 Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 Wow, very interesting! Looks really cool, thanks for the pics!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyroAce Posted July 22, 2012 Author Share Posted July 22, 2012 I made some Roman Candles with stars and they turned out really well! Now I am going to make some with inserts which will contain 6mm stars. Normally how many stars would be in these inserts? And what do the Chinese manufacturors use to break them, do they still use rice hulls coated in BP or do they just use granulated BP or meal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyroAce Posted July 22, 2012 Author Share Posted July 22, 2012 dagabu will you still be shooting your Candle at the PGI meet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Sadly, no. I am Chair of the Superstring this year and I need to concentrate on only it this year. -dag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyroAce Posted October 11, 2012 Author Share Posted October 11, 2012 dag those images you posted have gone? Must have happened with the new forum upgrade? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mortartube Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 I have just seen this thread. The small Chinese Dragon candles of 14mm and 18mm ID do not have sawdust in but granular clay, basically cat litter malleted down. Certainly all the ones I took apart did, and that was quite a few. The clay remains granular enough not to compact into a solid lump and is blown out with the lift of the star below. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyroAce Posted October 12, 2012 Author Share Posted October 12, 2012 These candles are so cheap and easy to make, you can make these for probably less than 50 cents per candle, here's some basic ones I made, Ralphs Glitter was the formula 1/2 Stars:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2i97sVgxwc Small Inserts with only 6 stars, 6mm stars:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4erlNyLy2E&feature=plcp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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