dangerousamateur Posted September 11, 2011 Share Posted September 11, 2011 Hi, I've got charcoal dust here that is pre-milled from the dealer, but no ball mill.If I use the "optimal composition" and wet mix the stuff together, what do you think, is it worth to try endburners? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allrocketspsl Posted September 11, 2011 Share Posted September 11, 2011 Hi, I've got charcoal dust here that is pre-milled from the dealer, but no ball mill.If I use the "optimal composition" and wet mix the stuff together, what do you think, is it worth to try endburners? without a ball mill the only way I was able to lift shells in mortars was to cook the comp then it was fast enough but its alot of work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrankRizzo Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 No, without a ballmill, you can't make BP hot enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerousamateur Posted September 12, 2011 Author Share Posted September 12, 2011 OK, thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan999ification Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 (edited) Hi, I've got charcoal dust here that is pre-milled from the dealer, but no ball mill.If I use the "optimal composition" and wet mix the stuff together, what do you think, is it worth to try endburners? i made plenty of endburners before i got a mill going you can but you will need fast charcoal evrything should be airfloat, you will however need a pestle and mortar until you get fed up,[ you will probably need one anyway] mine used to take half hour to make 10g which for me makes 2 10mm engines, they are about 3oz and have lifted 35g loads with the finished rocket weighing 65-75g.take the charcoal and sulphur grind for 10mins add the kno3 wet the pestle and grind for 20mins, the comp will dry out as you grind...test, you can come back to it later if its not fast enough, granulate with boiling water about 10-12% and no dextrin, worked for me but now i mill for 3 hours i have noticed a difference in performance, if the bp is not as fast as you need a smaller nozzle or more grinding will see em fly. dan. i have also lifted shells and comets from 1/2" to 3" 3-220g with bp made without a mill. Edited September 12, 2011 by dan999ification Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerousamateur Posted September 12, 2011 Author Share Posted September 12, 2011 It's grapevine, 40µm. Pretty fine *cough*And KNO3 comes pretty dusty out of the kitchen blender. i have also lifted shells and comets from 1/2" to 3" 3-220g with bp made without a mill.Using a coreburner? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allrocketspsl Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 (edited) Hi, I've got charcoal dust here that is pre-milled from the dealer, but no ball mill.If I use the "optimal composition" and wet mix the stuff together, what do you think, is it worth to try endburners? ask the ROCKETMAN dagabu hes the premier maker here mate, he knows his shit so when he chimes in take it for the gospel!Even though I think Im going to beat him out in the competion,lol! Edited September 12, 2011 by allrocketspsl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 It's grapevine, 40µm. Pretty fine *cough*And KNO3 comes pretty dusty out of the kitchen blender. Using a coreburner? KNO3 out of a blender is almost certainly not fine enough. If you actually screen it you'll be surprised at how little likely passes 200 mesh. 200 mesh is about as coarse as I'd consider getting toward fine enough. You can try, but be prepared for fountains on a stick, and low flying rockets. It definitely depends where you are in the world, but I've heard very hit or miss things about grape vine charcoal in terms of it's "hotness". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 (edited) ask the ROCKETMAN dagabu hes the premier maker here mate, he knows his shit so when he chimes in take it for the gospel!Even though I think Im going to beat him out in the competion,lol! Oh NO!! I am not the pro here, there are a bunch here that know much more then I do about rockets. That said, lets do a test and see what un-milled BP does compared to "airfloat" BP in an end burner. The first ones I made had scratch mix pressed to about 15,000psi and worked as good as the ones I make from milled BP but really, a side by side launch is the only way to make sure. -dag Edited September 12, 2011 by dagabu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan999ification Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 [quote Using a coreburner? no fired from tubes. dan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 (edited) no fired from tubes. dan. ??????????????????????????????????? It HAS to be a core burner or end burner. -dag Edited September 12, 2011 by dagabu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan999ification Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 (edited) he asked if it could be done it probably cant without a mill but can with a pestle and mortar.you still need to grind/mill in some way, unless you press the granny out of iti have fired rockets and shot shells with unmilled bp but pestle/mortar was used.all. dan. Edited September 12, 2011 by dan999ification Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 That still doesn't clarify if the rockets you were firing were in a core burning or end burning configuration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 I'm going to press these up tomorrow night, any ideas on the basic components? Should I use the Sulfur and KNO3 as is? -dag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mabuse00 Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 KNO3 out of a blender is almost certainly not fine enoughI grind mine the same way. Does that really matter if you wet mix it afterwards? It's getting dissolved anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 I think Mum was saying that if you dry grind the chems (one at a time) in a blender, they will still be large particles. -dag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 dan999ification had mentioned that when he made end burner mix in a mortar and pestle that all of the chems should be airfloat first. I was just commenting that KNO3 out of the blender isn't as fine as one may think. Thinking about it, it should all get ground up anyway in the mortar and pestle assuming you give it enough time. I'm not sure what you mean by it all getting dissolved when wet mixing however. The only way it really all is dissolved is in something like the CIA method. Sure if you grind it damp in a mortar and pestle some amount will dissolve, but more likely the majority is just being ground into a powder and being intimately mixed with the sulfur and charcoal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan999ification Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 i dont use a blender or a coffee grinder,yes the rockets i make are endburners [at the moment] [this is the endburner without a mill thread, most coreburner fuel does not require milling and use slower ratio's] the shells and comets that i mentioned were shot from tubes and only an example that the bp can be hot enough to shoot shells and make rockets from unmilled but still ground bp, ive even used it for break 50/50 on seeds [its not as fast as my milled bp now but it will work] the reason i like all airfloat chems first is to only reduce grinding time, 30 mins is a long time if you put your back into it [ i do ] and the results dont really improve unless your at it for three days. theres only one way to find out. dan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 theres only one way to find out. dan. I do like your thinking!! -dag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allrocketspsl Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 Oh NO!! I am not the pro here, there are a bunch here that know much more then I do about rockets. That said, lets do a test and see what un-milled BP does compared to "airfloat" BP in an end burner. The first ones I made had scratch mix pressed to about 15,000psi and worked as good as the ones I make from milled BP but really, a side by side launch is the only way to make sure. -dag what I meant was you have the tech side of the rocket with the actual making and performing I myself just ram and fire dont have the tech shit basics,you know more than you think my friend Im outside looking in! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 Thanks for the compliment but I really have a team of guys here to steer me, mum, Ralph, DrThrust and Frank correct me all the time and challenge me to prove my hypothesis which I can do most of the time but when i am full of beans, I take the butt kickin and learn from the mistake and move on. -dag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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