Mach25 Posted August 15, 2011 Share Posted August 15, 2011 (edited) If you are milling KNO3 with 1/3 of the charcoal amount is that completely uncombustable? If so would any grinding media work under this condition? I'm not keen on ball milling three ingredients so I was wondering what experience many here have with double ball milling scenario ? Seems to be the safest option for those that want to minimize an accidental explosion. I have large supply of rod grinding material. It will lightly spark when I put up against a grinder....Looks ceramic to me but I have not idea. Alumina seems to be a fortune. Edited August 15, 2011 by Mach25 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonny Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 If you are milling KNO3 with 1/3 of the charcoal amount is that completely uncombustable? If so would any grinding media work under this condition? I'm not keen on ball milling three ingredients so I was wondering what experience many here have with double ball milling scenario ? Seems to be the safest option for those that want to minimize an accidental explosion. I have large supply of rod grinding material. It will lightly spark when I put up against a grinder....Looks ceramic to me but I have not idea. Alumina seems to be a fortune. Many metals and some other materials will spark against a grinder. Even 1/3 of the charcoal is still combining a fuel and oxidizer. If you want to reduce the explosion potential, the FIRST thing to do is get rid of the unknown media you have. Get or make some lead/brass/alumina and go from there. Unless you are ONLY (ONLY)...did I say ONLY milling individual chems, anything that can spark should never be used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busspuppy Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 You would be better off not to even use sparking media whatsoever. In your case AFTER you get non-sparking media if you still dont want to mill BP all together I would just mill the sulfur and kno3. Then screen in the charcoal later. May take some tinkering but it should work. Also if you do that use airfloat charcoal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mach25 Posted August 16, 2011 Author Share Posted August 16, 2011 Many metals and some other materials will spark against a grinder. Even 1/3 of the charcoal is still combining a fuel and oxidizer. If you want to reduce the explosion potential, the FIRST thing to do is get rid of the unknown media you have. Get or make some lead/brass/alumina and go from there. Unless you are ONLY (ONLY)...did I say ONLY milling individual chems, anything that can spark should never be used. Thanks for the reply: According to Pyro creations the "critical proportions" can be adjusted to make the mixture incombustible. G.) Double & double component ball milling:The potential dangers of three component milling can be avoided by using double and double component milling. The idea is to use two seperate steps of ball milling and to integrate the results by non-milling means (e.g. by screening). In this case the possible performance gain of milling the oxidizer together with a fuel is still taken into account but the oxidizer-fuel ratio is modified in a way producing a non-combustible compound. While milling compounds showing mixing ratios of potassium nitrate to charcoal varying between 4:1 and 6:1 (also called the critical proportions) in actual fact is still as dangerous as three component milling, the oxidizer-fuel mix becomes incombustible when we raise the proportions to 15:1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mach25 Posted August 16, 2011 Author Share Posted August 16, 2011 You would be better off not to even use sparking media whatsoever. In your case AFTER you get non-sparking media if you still dont want to mill BP all together I would just mill the sulfur and kno3. Then screen in the charcoal later. May take some tinkering but it should work. Also if you do that use airfloat charcoal. Thanks for the reply. Are you using Cubic Zirc or Alumina...and boy thats stuffs expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busspuppy Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 Thanks for the reply. Are you using Cubic Zirc or Alumina...and boy thats stuffs expensive. I use reinforced lead balls. (1/2in). Sorry for late reply got busy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonny Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Thanks for the reply: According to Pyro creations the "critical proportions" can be adjusted to make the mixture incombustible. G.) Double & double component ball milling:The potential dangers of three component milling can be avoided by using double and double component milling. The idea is to use two seperate steps of ball milling and to integrate the results by non-milling means (e.g. by screening). In this case the possible performance gain of milling the oxidizer together with a fuel is still taken into account but the oxidizer-fuel ratio is modified in a way producing a non-combustible compound. While milling compounds showing mixing ratios of potassium nitrate to charcoal varying between 4:1 and 6:1 (also called the critical proportions) in actual fact is still as dangerous as three component milling, the oxidizer-fuel mix becomes incombustible when we raise the proportions to 15:1. Seems like a huge PITA to play with ratios to avoid milling it all together. Just get some non sparking media and load it all together in a SAFE place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guntoteninfadel Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 The things I have found is: 1-Lead does not spark and is cheap. I thought lead balls worked great untill I went to pvc jars and zirc M. Lead also deteriorates at a fairly fast pace. .50 turned to .38 after about 2 months of milling. 2-Zirc M is not cheap. But if you look for deals it is not that expensive either. I am not sure what it is made to mill but I have not noticed any wear with chems. It is also a lot faster. I am using 4" and 6" pvc jars with the zirc m and the difference is remarkable. 3-Non sparking media gives you peace of mind...... self explanatory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mach25 Posted August 19, 2011 Author Share Posted August 19, 2011 (edited) Seems like a huge PITA to play with ratios to avoid milling it all together. Just get some non sparking media and load it all together in a SAFE place. Yeah I agree I have a factory located in a populated area so I need to be careful. I have an open field but I;m still not loving that idea. If double milling can achieve comparable lift and burst material and reduce the danger significantly then it might be a way to go for me. Thanks for the reply Edited August 19, 2011 by Mach25 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mach25 Posted August 19, 2011 Author Share Posted August 19, 2011 The things I have found is: 1-Lead does not spark and is cheap. I thought lead balls worked great untill I went to pvc jars and zirc M. Lead also deteriorates at a fairly fast pace. .50 turned to .38 after about 2 months of milling. 2-Zirc M is not cheap. But if you look for deals it is not that expensive either. I am not sure what it is made to mill but I have not noticed any wear with chems. It is also a lot faster. I am using 4" and 6" pvc jars with the zirc m and the difference is remarkable. 3-Non sparking media gives you peace of mind...... self explanatory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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