oldguy Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 http://aerialfx.com/files/Prox.wmv 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 WOW!!!! OK, whats the comp? Sign me up for 100#!! -dag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 They're NC and titanium or zirconium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 They're NC and titanium or zirconium. That's very pretty, I had a commercial one from Skylighter a few years ago, cant find them locally. -dag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldguy Posted July 6, 2011 Author Share Posted July 6, 2011 They're NC and titanium or zirconium. That is about what I thought on the indoor 1.The outdoor 1, I am not sure about. For outdoors, would AP & Ti work as well?I ask because AP is far cheaper than NC in bulk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbobaker Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 NC, is that nitrocellulose?What is AP?those were pretty nice videos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seymour Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 AP, in fireworks anyway, means Ammonium perchlorate, NH4ClO4. Yep, NC means Nitrocellulose. You should be able to get a somewhat similar fountain by adding AP to a fuel, and then adding Ti to that. Unlike Nitrocellulose, Ammonium perchlorate is not a propellant on it's own, just a very nice gasious oxidiser. There will be differences between AP mixes and NC. There may be smoke: AP mixes are only "smokeless" in low humidity. In high humidity the HCl in the exhaust seeds rolling clouds of water vapor (with that sweet HCl smell!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 You can tune AP compositions (carefully of course) to avoid producing HCl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbobaker Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Thanks, I'm lost in all those abbreviations etc.I've learned to make decent BP however and that is the first step in learning to write in the sky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
optimus Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 You can tune AP compositions (carefully of course) to avoid producing HCl. I never heard about this, could you elaborate? I recently tried an AP/hexamine/Ti flake gerb which worked rather well, very similar effect to the indoor NC ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldguy Posted July 7, 2011 Author Share Posted July 7, 2011 After some tinkering AP - Stearine - Ti has the same effect.Burns so cool, you can (quickly) wave your hand through the sparks 1 ft above the gerb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 (edited) After some tinkering AP - Stearine - Ti has the same effect.Burns so cool, you can (quickly) wave your hand through the sparks 1 ft above the gerb. Forgive my chemical ignorance but what is Stearine? Is it the same as Stearic Acid? Like what is used in candle making? -dag Edited July 7, 2011 by dagabu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Yes, stearin = stearic acid as far as terms go. I haven't an idea why they're used interchangeably. In the most critical definitions, stearin is a triglyceride of stearic acid. I get the impression the free fatty acid or the triglyceride behave pretty similarly for what we're doing. I guess the balancing act with ammonium perchlorate is more critical with colored stars to be used indoors, specifically where chlorine donors are present. Something like a sparking fountain should be pretty easy. Essentially you have to make sure the emitting species is getting enough Cl, without making a caustic smoke/gas. It's really just adjusting fuel ratios until you find a balancing point. A roughly stoichiometric mix of AP and hexamine should work fine, but will probably make a little bit of smoke, though probably not an issue. I'd use a little excess hexamine. Hexamine tends to be a good scavenger of free HCl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 I would like to see the recipe... please good sirs? -dag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Recipe for what exactly? [edit]Ah, the smokeless gerbs. The following is just where I'd start. It's stoichiometric, with 1 part AP swapped for 1 part hexamine. Ammonium Perchlorate - 78.5Hexamine - 11.5Titanium - 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldguy Posted July 7, 2011 Author Share Posted July 7, 2011 Recipe for what exactly? [edit]Ah, the smokeless gerbs. The following is just where I'd start. It's stoichiometric, with 1 part AP swapped for 1 part hexamine. Ammonium Perchlorate - 78.5Hexamine - 11.5Titanium - 10 That is almost exactly recipe I used, that burned off just like the #1 video.Except, I used Stearin (Stearic Acid) instead of Hexamine.Ti used was -40+300 mesh spherical from skylighter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
optimus Posted July 8, 2011 Share Posted July 8, 2011 (edited) Anything based on the blue steel gerb would probably work well too: Ammonium perchlorate 65Hexamine 10Stearic acid 7Copper carbonate 6Steel, fine powder 12 I've found a Ti version of this a great use for my <325mesh Ti sponge. Edited July 8, 2011 by optimus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagabu Posted July 8, 2011 Share Posted July 8, 2011 Thanks guys! This is a real find for me. -dag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seymour Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Burns so cool, you can (quickly) wave your hand through the sparks 1 ft above the gerb. You can do that with most spark effects, though maybe I'm just ruthless. Just stay away from the glitter spritzels! I've got a formula based loosely on the blue steel gerbe that I'm quite fond of at present. It burns faster, hotter and brighter, though still with the fantastic blue and crackling titanium sparks. I've greatly enjoyed making morning glory style sparklers with it, and plan to use it in pillbox stars once I'm less busy. Ammonium perchlorate 63Copper benzoate 19Titanium 10Copper (II) oxide 4Nitrocellulose 4 The NC is not really needed, it's just a convenient binder (and it does increase the flame size). Titanium size depends on the application. In sparkers I'd have it quite fine, a bit more coarse for fountains, and perhaps coarser yet in stars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasanthsac Posted September 22, 2018 Share Posted September 22, 2018 (edited) AP, in fireworks anyway, means Ammonium perchlorate, NH4ClO4. Yep, NC means Nitrocellulose. You should be able to get a somewhat similar fountain by adding AP to a fuel, and then adding Ti to that. Unlike Nitrocellulose, Ammonium perchlorate is not a propellant on it's own, just a very nice gasious oxidiser. There will be differences between AP mixes and NC. There may be smoke: AP mixes are only "smokeless" in low humidity. In high humidity the HCl in the exhaust seeds rolling clouds of water vapor (with that sweet HCl smell!).Hi... Great to be in the forum. May I ask you the replacement for AP. It is not available for me here . Can you help? I tried Stabilised Granulated NC with KNO3 ..but the smell and smoke is unavoidable.. Need your help. Edited September 22, 2018 by vasanthsac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasanthsac Posted September 22, 2018 Share Posted September 22, 2018 Hi , Happy to be in the Forum. Is there a formula to make Indoor Smokeless Gerb . Is there a replacement for Amonium nitrate to add with NC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasanthsac Posted September 22, 2018 Share Posted September 22, 2018 (edited) Anything based on the blue steel gerb would probably work well too: Ammonium perchlorate 65Hexamine 10Stearic acid 7Copper carbonate 6Steel, fine powder 12 I've found a Ti version of this a great use for my <325mesh Ti sponge.Hi Optimus, Is there a replacement for Ammonium perchlorate ?? with NC combo.. kindly suggest. Edited September 22, 2018 by vasanthsac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vishal Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 Which of these chemicals must be granulated and how?i want to know the whole process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arw Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 HiI want to make an indoor fountain by NChave you any idea to how should i powder NC and what percent of Ti and NCcan I use Iron instead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arw Posted April 15, 2021 Share Posted April 15, 2021 (edited) Hi again!!!I made my indoor fountain but its not make enough pressureThen i buy a chinese oneThere is somthing granol in there that burn just like NCcould it be cordite ?!?!?There is no AP in therehttps://ibb.co/LnjDM6Jhttps://ibb.co/hFyKVL0 Edited April 15, 2021 by Arw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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