Strobe rockets

[Ralph]

Before someone points out that there is already a strobe rocket thread frankly the question asked was moronic and there isnt a shred of good info in there so I thought I would start a fresh one

 

 

Strobe rockets they sure look awesome and there is a bit of info out there on them (like the skylighter article) but nothing beats first hand "face to face chatting"

I already know all the basic info on them will be using oxychloride whistle and will be using AP bassed strobe mix

so who here has made them

what should I watch out for

and is going from a straight whistle grain and shortening it and adding more strobe till I stop getting catos the best way to tune these in

 

Thanks In advance

[dagabu]

Man Ralph! Gonna go right for the throat on this one huh?

 

There are a dozen comps for strobe and maybe two dozen guys that successfully make them day in, day out. Every one of those people have had to tweak their strobe countless times to dial them in so that they dont CATO (whistle boost portion) or strobe too fast or too slow.

 

I used Neds tutorial on Skylighter with great success, just follow the steps exactly. One note from Dan T. when tweaking or developing a strobe, make a good sized batch of strobe sans the MgAL and make micro batches, just enough for one rocket with the size or combination of sizes of MgAl, and test it till you get what you are looking for.

 

Good luck!

 

-dag

[Ralph]

Thanks cant count on a serious answer if the rest of the thread is dedicated to saying learn to use google and no you cant make strobes with hiff

 

Ill be brinign up 200 tubes enough strobe and whistle for all of that chems for flash and a few headers onlong with tooling sticks hot glue and a press and paper and pensils (so I can draw a template each time) I plan on using Mg strobes and am not to fussed about the strobe rates Ill be equally content with a machine gun/helicopter or even a 1hz or so

[killforfood]

Good luck Ralph. I'm kinda jealous. I saw Ned's Strobe rocket video and thought it was soooo cool. I would love to build them but Whistle and flash are two comps I'm not willing to mess with.

I hope you document your successes and failures so we can follow along and be jealous.

 

Here's the Rabbit you're chasing.

 

[dagabu]

and is going from a straight whistle grain and shortening it and adding more strobe till I stop getting catos the best way to tune these in

 

With the fuel all the way to the top of the spindle: Sali based whistle on a longer spindle like the strobe spindle, you will get CATOs, with the Benzo based whistle, you shouldn't have to worry about CATOs. I have never seen a straight Mg strobe comp but I would still start with 200 mesh Mg. Also, I cant tell from your post but you will need a spindle to get the strobe sound from the rocket, the traditional White Strobe comp is fine as a solid grain but the ones that you can hear as well as see are all made on a spindle. Largely, the amount of strobe on top of the whistle will determine how loud and bright the pulses are but will not greatly effect the timing, the metal mesh size will determine that.

 

-dag

[Algenco]

Neds strobe are great! I've been priviledged to witness a couple

[Ralph]

With the fuel all the way to the top of the spindle: Sali based whistle on a longer spindle like the strobe spindle, you will get CATOs, with the Benzo based whistle, you shouldn't have to worry about CATOs. I have never seen a straight Mg strobe comp but I would still start with 200 mesh Mg. Also, I cant tell from your post but you will need a spindle to get the strobe sound from the rocket, the traditional White Strobe comp is fine as a solid grain but the ones that you can hear as well as see are all made on a spindle. Largely, the amount of strobe on top of the whistle will determine how loud and bright the pulses are but will not greatly effect the timing, the metal mesh size will determine that.

 

-dag

 

Ive done my reasearch and have in my hot little hands some good strobe tooling,

shimazu has several Mg strobe comps (apparently thats were the best colour is at)

 

My reason for posting is for tips like

when tweaking or developing a strobe, make a good sized batch of strobe sans the MgAL and make micro batches, just enough for one rocket with the size or combination of sizes of MgAl, and test it till you get what you are looking for.

which you dont find wirten in articles

[dagabu]

shimazu has several Mg strobe comps (apparently thats were the best colour is at)

 

Ahhhhhh, colored strobe!! Now I get it

 

-dag

[azure]

Just something from my own experience,

 

If you have trouble with getting your composition to strobe decently (continues burning) , experiment with the amount of potassium dichromate in the mix.

Less (or none) dichromate makes for a far better strobe composition (without having to add relative big amounts of coarse metal which can be a pain to source sometimes).

 

If you use magnesium, the lack of coating could prove to be a problem when you're planning to store the mix or motors for more then 6 months tho.

Edited May 14, 2011 by azure

[Ralph]

Just something from my own experience,

 

If you have trouble with getting your composition to strobe decently (continues burning) , experiment with the amount of potassium dichromate in the mix.

Less (or none) dichromate makes for a far better strobe composition (without having to add relative big amounts of coarse metal which can be a pain to source sometimes).

 

If you use magnesium, the lack of coating could prove to be a problem when you're planning to store the mix or motors for more then 6 months tho.

 

Thanks for the tip I guess Ill test that out too. Ill be using retreated Magnesium though Im not going to rely on the dichromate in the mix to passivated the Magnesium

[parabolic]

might be a silly question as i'm not educated in chemistry....is there still no alternative from using dichromate? it's the only thing thats really putting me off making them.

 

Ralph, thanks for starting this thread, I been looking for good strobe info for a while. I was inspired by a user CPLMAC, my god he makes some impressive strobe rockets

[Ralph]

there is no good alternative thats readily available the compound needs to a react with magnesium bellow 100 degrees forming an insoluble non porous reacting product which can be relied upon to completely coat the whole piece of magnesium that wont flake off yet with out to much heat in the presence of an oxidiser can be easily broken and allow the magnesium to react as intended

[Bilbobaker]

Good luck Ralph. I'm kinda jealous. I saw Ned's Strobe rocket video and thought it was soooo cool. I would love to build them but Whistle and flash are two comps I'm not willing to mess with.

I hope you document your successes and failures so we can follow along and be jealous.

 

Here's the Rabbit you're chasing.

 

 

Is it dangerous, unstable, expensive or just too loud?

I can't make them until I get permits completed but really like the sound of them.

Edited May 18, 2011 by Bilbobaker

[dagabu]

Is it dangerous, unstable, expensive or just too loud?

I can't make them until I get permits completed but really like the sound of them.

 

"Potassium dichromate is one of the most common causes of chromium dermatitis; chromium is highly likely to induce sensitization leading to dermatitis, especially of the hand and fore-arms, which is chronic and difficult to treat. It is also toxic, with doses of approximately 100 mg/kg being fatal in rabbits and rodents.

 

As with other CrVI compounds, potassium dichromate is carcinogenic and should be handled with gloves and appropriate health and safety protection. The compound is also corrosive and exposure may produce severe eye damage or blindness."

-WP-

[Ralph]

Is it dangerous, unstable, expensive or just too loud?

I can't make them until I get permits completed but really like the sound of them.

 

 

 

He said Strobe and whistle are 2 comps he isn't willing to play with because they are sensitive and quite powerful explosives just like flash if you have an accident youll certainly know about it. Strobe mix has the added dangerous of highly reactive metals in contact with AP Seymour told me that it only rook 10 min for an AP and powdered MgAl (uncoated) mix to ignite . Both fuels will explode on impact, whistle is sensitive to static (don't know if strobe is or isn't) and special tooling is required

so there are lots of reasons why someone might want to avoid them

[dagabu]

. Both fuels will explode on impact, whistle is sensitive to static (don't know if strobe is or isn't) and special tooling is required

so there are lots of reasons why someone might want to avoid them

 

What special tooling is needed?

 

-dag

[Ralph]

What special tooling is needed?

 

-dag

 

strobe tooling or universal tooling

 

you cant just press the whistle and than the strobe than pull out a drill bit and hand drill in like you could with black powder

[WonderBoy]

BP tooling works too...

[dagabu]

strobe tooling or universal tooling

 

you cant just press the whistle and than the strobe than pull out a drill bit and hand drill in like you could with black powder

 

Gotcha! I thought something even more special.

 

-dag

[azure]

Seymour told me that it only rook 10 min for an AP and powdered MgAl (uncoated) mix to ignite .

 

Wow i wonder how that's possible.

I've mixed (uncoated) magnesium and NH4ClO4 several times and never witnessed such an event.

[Algenco]

Wow i wonder how that's possible.

I've mixed (uncoated) magnesium and NH4ClO4 several times and never witnessed such an event.

 

 

Moisture

[Ralph]

Wow i wonder how that's possible.

I've mixed (uncoated) magnesium and NH4ClO4 several times and never witnessed such an event.

 

 

 

well to be honest when I tried to recreate it even with putting a drop off water it only turned into a warm spongy mass (this may be due to the large particle size of the magnesium in comparison to the magnalium that Seymour might have used) either way warm spongy mass sure wont perform properly

[Zmuro]

I made two strobe rockets last month, but the strobing rate was a little to fast for my opinion. I used standard AP formula with 74um magnalium and 3% mineral oil. Should I use more coarse magnalium? On Dany Creagan site, it's mentioned that you should only use 4000-5000 psi on strobe fuel and 8000 on whistle, but I used 8000 psi on strobe, so maybe this is the reason for such high strobing rate.