Mario1 Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 (edited) Ok so im going to build a ball mill I got this motor from a vaccum cleaner. Now im lost on what to do next. and when I turn it on it goes crazy and flips out all over the place. Help! Where do i connect the thing that the motor spins? also can i have a list of everything I need to buy. My budget is $27. Edited August 8, 2009 by Mario1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightHawkInLight Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 (edited) You will need to gear the motor down to a reasonable pace with a series of pulleys. Mounting them to a section of 2x6" might be a good way to go. As for what you need to buy, there is no master list. You must figure out for yourself how you want your mill designed and buy materials accordingly. Almost everyone who builds a mill does it out of materials they already have, many of which would be expensive if bought new. I doubt anyone will be able to tell you just what you need to buy. Figure it out. They may however be able to tell you how to gear the motor down to a good speed. To secure it I would recommend using metal straps and screwing down to a 2x6" Edited August 8, 2009 by NightHawkInLight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mario1 Posted August 8, 2009 Author Share Posted August 8, 2009 Ya I dont know how to gear it down... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KruseMissile Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 you need to find out at what speed the motor turns at(RPMs). From there you will need to gear it down(as NightHawkInLight said). You will also need steel rods, heater hose(this covers the rods and helps grip the jar), and some mounted bearings. The mounted bearings will probally be the hardest to get but you can find them all over the internet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mario1 Posted August 8, 2009 Author Share Posted August 8, 2009 How do I find the RPM and how do I gear it down? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUUUUUN Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 Do you know how gears/pulleys work??? Not the teeth part, nor the changing of directions part, but the different velocites depending on the radius part. Do you understand how that works? The RPMs whould be somwhere on the motor.. something like a sticker or a riveted metal tag should tell you things like, Starting draw(probably Watts), running draw(Watts again), RPMs, Horse power rating, and possibly manufacturing serial number, and date of manufacture. That is how you find out RPMs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyboy Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 That motor spins way to fast to be of any real use. A modern vacuum cleaner motor spins at up to 45.000 RPM's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 Start saving and buy a small rock tumbler! A tumbler rated at 500 grammes or a pound will make a batch of about 50 - 75g of powder. Buy a rock tumbler and the whole thing arrives at your door ready to use! All you add is media and ingredients! Most pople who make a mill have a good mill in the end, BUT they have a pile of parts left that proved unsuitable but consumed money and time. If you don't have the design skill to make your own mill then buy a mill! Vacuum cleaner motors are often brush motors which will spark so they are totally unsuited to pyro. Your mill drum needs to rotate at about 50 - 80rpm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peedee Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 Vac motors tend to be universal type, which means they will rev like crazy under no load so you may have fun get big enough ratios to gear it down. I'm guessing it will be trial and error depending on the load you put on it. (and the brush issue as Arthur mentioned) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 Yeah, sorry to bear bad news, but that motor simply will not work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mario1 Posted August 9, 2009 Author Share Posted August 9, 2009 (edited) Ok no problem. I just noticed that It was sparking so I figured that would not be good for a mill. I got some money now so I can buy a mill. Edited August 9, 2009 by Mario1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mario1 Posted August 9, 2009 Author Share Posted August 9, 2009 Could anyone point me in the right direction to buy a good quality ball mill? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mario1 Posted August 9, 2009 Author Share Posted August 9, 2009 (edited) Also on skylighter can you buy all the chemicals togather? Like KNO3 sulfur and bentinite clay in the same order? Thanks! Edited August 9, 2009 by Mario1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ventsi Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 Well they do have a BP special pack where you buy KNO3,Charcoal,Sulfur,Red Gum as one package and save money ,So yeah you should be fine.Just dont buy any chlorates ,perchlorates or metal fuels on your first order and you should be fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEskimo Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 Don't get that pack from Skylighter. It's a piece of crap. I got it for the cheaper chems, not for the good BP. The only good use for is the charcoal for stars, the red gum for stars, and the KNO3 for whatever you're doing. The lift is crappy, expect more of a fountain, than lift. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUUUUUN Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 (edited) Most people here just use a rock tumbler instead of a ball mill, you can find rock tumblers all over the internet ranging from cheap to very high end with dual jars and several pound capacities. Search around until you find a decent rock tumbler in your price range, make sure you read any consumer reviews, though, the price may be really low for a reason(bad bearings, too small a motor, bad/cheap construction, things of that nature). Edited August 9, 2009 by RUUUUUN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 If you have a price band in mind, look out a rock tumbler in your price band and post a link on here, see what other pyros think. I certainly would NOT ask my rock tumbler supplier whethet it would make good BP! I suspect 50% of their output is to pyros but I'd rather they didn't actually have the evidence! Look on this site from the UK http://www.manchesterminerals.co.uk/acatal...g_Machines.html The small drums will take about 50 to 75 g of compound with media so the "Mini" mill will make 50g of BP in 12 hours, The drums for 1400g rock will take a batch of about 100 - 200g to BP in 8 - 12 hours. The mill sold for 2250g of rock will make a 1Kilo batch of BP to a good speed in 3 hours or to fastest in 8 hours. Rubber drums are more expensive but MUCH quieter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 Don't get that pack from Skylighter. It's a piece of crap. I got it for the cheaper chems, not for the good BP. The only good use for is the charcoal for stars, the red gum for stars, and the KNO3 for whatever you're doing. The lift is crappy, expect more of a fountain, than lift. It's not crap, it is what it is. The KNO3 and Sulfur are fine. The charcoal makes BP that can lift or burst. It's not balsa or alder, but it is serviceable. If all you got was fountain, then your technique is at fault. The separate chemicals can be found cheaper, yes, but I've always respected Skylighter for promoting this hobby as they do. I think they've brought more serious hobbyists into pyrotechnics than the rest of the suppliers put together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightHawkInLight Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 It's not crap, it is what it is. The KNO3 and Sulfur are fine. The charcoal makes BP that can lift or burst. It's not balsa or alder, but it is serviceable. If all you got was fountain, then your technique is at fault. The separate chemicals can be found cheaper, yes, but I've always respected Skylighter for promoting this hobby as they do. I think they've brought more serious hobbyists into pyrotechnics than the rest of the suppliers put together.I agree. They're about the only pyro company out there who makes you think 'Wow, this must be about more than just blowing up mailboxes!' They know what they're doing is legal (at least for now) and are not afraid to publicize it. I think that helps us in the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 Having dedicated pyro supply web sites is a fabulous asset! It saves you having to buy from sites that also supply other organic precursors, with the attendant risks. If you find something from Skylighter that doesn't do as they say then Likely your technique is at fault! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 (edited) They know what they're doing is legal (at least for now) and are not afraid to publicize it. I think that helps us in the end. Not to flog this thread, but this ^^^ is SO important. Skylighter boldly states "LET'S MAKE SOME COOL FIREWORKS OUT OF RAW CHEMICALS! Here's EXACTLY how to do it!" No waffling, no feeble attempt to disguise the supplies as something other than what they are, no attempt to be elitist and cater only to licensees... you've got to like it. If we had more people and companies like that, this wouldn't be some sneaky "underground" hobby with everyone looking over their shoulders. I know it is different outside the U.S. and you do what you gotta do, but I like their attitude. And for that reason alone, Skylighter gets a lot of business from me. I'll pay a bit extra on occasion and am happy to do so. Edited August 17, 2009 by Swede Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoorBoy Posted August 19, 2009 Share Posted August 19, 2009 If I had the money I would buy from skylighter too lol. I agree with you guys though because skylighter was my main source of information prior to APC. I still refernce skylighter in conjunction with other info. It was sky lighter that made me realize fireworks without 3oz of atomic flash powder could be fun too. The first real firework i ever made was a 2" arial ball shell with flying fish fuse inside. Still haven't made anything other than ball shells lol one day i will learn to crawl and make a fountain or a star mine. I dont know why but i think shells are easier than anything else. I havent made anything larger than 3" and right now im working backwards and trying to make little festival balls. The only thing i can say to put down sky lighter is they made it so easy to learn to make the big stuff i am having a hard time with the little stuff. S#$T% festival balls are so finicky with the gap between mortar and ball and it keeps changing the lift... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lodcomm Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 Not to flog this thread, but this ^^^ is SO important. Skylighter boldly states "LET'S MAKE SOME COOL FIREWORKS OUT OF RAW CHEMICALS! Here's EXACTLY how to do it!" No waffling, no feeble attempt to disguise the supplies as something other than what they are, no attempt to be elitist and cater only to licensees... you've got to like it. If we had more people and companies like that, this wouldn't be some sneaky "underground" hobby with everyone looking over their shoulders. I know it is different outside the U.S. and you do what you gotta do, but I like their attitude. And for that reason alone, Skylighter gets a lot of business from me. I'll pay a bit extra on occasion and am happy to do so. Swede, I agree with you wholeheartedly - Skylighter does do a lot to promote the hobby, and they do a lot to show that there is far more to the pyrotechnic community than simply blowing things up. I also do a lot of business with them and, like you - I don't mind paying a bit more now and then to help support the fine folks there. -t Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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