Arthur Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 I'm looking for a fully functional, vintage looking plunger type firing box for legal shipment to the UK. It's for the use the bride/client to push to start the show. Can anyone advise where to source one, Are they still made? Does any forum member make or trade these? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richtee Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 I'm looking for a fully functional, vintage looking plunger type firing box for legal shipment to the UK. It's for the use the bride/client to push to start the show. Can anyone advise where to source one, Are they still made? Does any forum member make or trade these? Perhaps just the LOOK of one..that closes a contact. The originals were a magneto generator system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 You can occasionally find them on ebay. I check every so often, just from how cool they are. They've become quite the collector's item. Expect something on the order of $150-200. Functional units at this price are becoming rarer and rarer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGM Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 Some blasting operations use hand-crank ignition systems, so finding a functional plunger box would probably be within the realm of possibility, but I think most of what you find will be an antique and probably not functional. Making a regular battery powered igniter, putting it all in a red box, and having a plunger instead of a firing switch would probably be the easiest way to do it, like ritchee said. I'd love to make one that at least looks like the old style ones, I'd set everything off with it, even bottle rockets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike_au Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 I remember reading a discussion on this subject a while ago. Someone pointed out that the law in their area required a licensed operator to be firing the show and the device that fired it had to have certain safety features built in. They set up the plunger (or big red button or what ever it was) but all it did was signal the person in charge to push the real buttons. Just something to think about if you have licensing/insurance to worry about. I agree with Richtee that you want one that closes contacts rather than spinning a generator, but keep the generator or at least a gearbox + flywheel in it so you get the proper feel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted May 27, 2009 Author Share Posted May 27, 2009 I have the legalities of letting the bride fire the show all sorted! -Well for the UK anyway! OK Ebay is one port of call, what are these machines properly called? Has anyone seen one close up? Is there anything written on one that would be good search terms? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonny Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 I have the legalities of letting the bride fire the show all sorted! -Well for the UK anyway! OK Ebay is one port of call, what are these machines properly called? Has anyone seen one close up? Is there anything written on one that would be good search terms? I found a little bit of info here, but not much...http://brassgoggles.co.uk/forum/index.php?...mp;topic=780.15 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
optimus Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 Might be worth having a chat with whoever had one at the Icarus meet. I believe it was all reconditioned and working as it would've originally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted May 27, 2009 Author Share Posted May 27, 2009 Thanks for the Steampunk link -perhaps DIY is a way forward. The machine in the youtube clip as found at Icarus party is fully functional but in current professional use so it's only available at professional day rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 One could probably be made with a bicycle generator and a flywheel. Not an impossible project, but not trivial to do it nice. You'd want a well-made wood box with dovetail or similar joinery, and to make it look old, some stain and maybe an NC lacquer finish. Internally, the plunger is a rack which turns a pinion. The pinion is keyed (same shaft) to a heavier flywheel to give it that old-time feel. Somewhere in there, the bicycle generator gets turned. If the squibs need more oomph, there could be an internal gel-cell, either directly switched, or you could even have the generator close a relay which closes the circuit. A hidden (or obvious) safety switch breaks the circuit as needed. It'd be a cool project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted June 2, 2009 Author Share Posted June 2, 2009 I could make a working fictionof a machine by pytting a battery in the box and having a contact somewhere on the rack n pinion. Ebay.com seems to have one or two Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 I was unable to find anything associated with explosives, but there were a large number of the hand-cranked telephone magneto/generators which might be adaptable if you wanted actual functionality, but with all that, it would certainly be easier to fake one. Good luck with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bananaphone69 Posted July 21, 2009 Share Posted July 21, 2009 (edited) I didn't realize they were so rare... my grandpa and dad both graduated from Missouri S&T (formerly UMR) as mining engineers and my dad has two fully functional models (one in his home office and one at his work) and my grandpa has one or two around his house... We some times use them as a novelty item to light of clusters of mortars fused together, and when I was younger, we would shock each other with them. Edited July 21, 2009 by Bananaphone69 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted July 21, 2009 Author Share Posted July 21, 2009 They are like gold dust now! Better looking ones START at $400 on ebay but tatty and broken ones get expensive in the last few minutes. As antiques they seem to be in fashion at the moment, so it's a bad time to look for a cheap one to use. In the UK they are a great sales point -brides love them! I'm likely to go into a short production run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted July 22, 2009 Share Posted July 22, 2009 (edited) I didn't realize they were so rare... my grandpa and dad both graduated from Missouri S&T (formerly UMR) as mining engineers and my dad has two fully functional models (one in his home office and one at his work) and my grandpa has one or two around his house... We some times use them as a novelty item to light of clusters of mortars fused together, and when I was younger, we would shock each other with them. As Arthur said, they are quite valuable. Treat them with care. Leave all the original finish intact, but avoid buggering them any further. People pay a premium for the more famous name plates (like DuPont), but if they are clean, original, and functional, cha-ching. I'd like to get a WW2-vintage blasting machine, the type that does a side-twist, or a Vietnam-era M57, which I think they used for claymores. Beyond the functionality, they are a cool bit of history. Edited July 22, 2009 by Swede Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted July 23, 2009 Author Share Posted July 23, 2009 (edited) The fist twist ones are much cheaper they seem to go for $100 - 150 on ebay. The twist ones are too blokey for UK weddings. For function I have a twist machine, for the bride's use at weddings a want a push down machine but for $500 I can have a fair repro built in the UK and have change. Even the $100 to get one across the pond is a lot of money! Edited July 23, 2009 by Arthur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weasel Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 You could always just build a wood box and stick a switch at the bottom of the box, then put a dowel above that with a handle, and when someone then shoves this dowel down into this finished box it will press the switch and light your show. It won't work like the old ones, but it could look exactly like them, which is all you really need for this. You would need a dowel support in there so it won't miss the button, and you could attatch some springs in there so the dowel returns back up. you could also stain the box so it looks nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richtee Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 You could always just build a wood box and stick a switch at the bottom of the box, Hmm now THERE'S an idea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flying fish Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 The most critical requirement is that you paint a big "ACME" on the side of it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 A simple switch takes all the Wile E Coyote fun out of it though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richtee Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 A simple switch takes all the Wile E Coyote fun out of it though. Well..it could bump a marble...which would run down a trough, that trips a mousetrap that then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 That sounds more Rube Goldberg to me. On a completely unrelated note, I should be a National Rube Goldberg Champion. Those assholes didn't set up the table right, and it collapsed during one of our runs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richtee Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 That sounds more Rube Goldberg to me. On a completely unrelated note, I should be a National Rube Goldberg Champion. Those assholes didn't set up the table right, and it collapsed during one of our runs.ooo do tell..with pix?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 (edited) Do they still make those bicycle generators, the ones that "tip" a small wheel onto the bike wheel, thus generating electricity? I had one as a kid. The drag was pretty significant when you engaged the generator. Ah, here's one on Amazon for $15...http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41C587WNE3L._SL500_AA280_.jpg Add a big flywheel onto the generator, and somehow engage that flywheel to the plunger. Or, gear the generator shaft so that it spins with a high RPM in some fashion. The hard part about the originals are the rack teeth on the plunger, and the internal pinion. If those can be done away with, you can still get the functionality and feel with a generator like this one. I'd test it first to be sure it puts out enough juice before making a box for it. Darn it now I'm tempted to buy yet another gadget just because I'm curious. Edit: Well, I did buy one, just not the black one. I bought this one, which looks more like what I remember as a kid.http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31fd6kSlyDL._SL500_AA280_.jpg Edited July 30, 2009 by Swede Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted July 30, 2009 Author Share Posted July 30, 2009 A little research showed that the generator inside a plunger and the twist type firing machine is very simple very reliable and robust unit. It has to be because there are still functional machines over 100 years old. Remember that in the early days "dry batteries" were rare, expensive and unreliable. Rechargables were lead acid in glass jars! It is a magnetic circuit that charges on the push down and discharges as the plunger gets to the bottom. At least part of the force pushing the plunger down is used to magnetise the field ironwork (in those days it may be just soft iron laminate). The advantage of the push all the way to the bottom design is that a small energy input is released very quickly as the rack hits the bottom stop. So the necessary pulse of over half an amp for 50 milliseconds can come from a 100v spike from the machine. Hence the reason that touching the wing nuts as the plunger hits the bottom can give you a shock. Lots of aspects are challenging now. The rack bears on a pinion of only a few teeth to get a huge, speed increasing, gear ratio. There is a ratchet so that the generator only spins one way. Be careful when playing with simple generators! If the steady output current is between the safe test current and the certain all fire current for the igs in use then some may go and some may NOT. Leading to a misfire situation that needs to be cleared - an added and un-necessary danger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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