The best flash powder

[TheSidewinder]

Oh I'm sorry! just my mother language isn't English, I'm from Israel, and in the israely pyrotechnic forum we're using almost only AP for TATP because we can't get Ammonium Perchlorate in israel.

I thought about it and I realy can't lite anything rite now because of the situation in my country.

Sorry about the English.

ltf

Sorry to hear about the bullshit going on in Israel and Lebanon. I have no idea how that mess can be solved.....

 

But your English is fine. I'm confused by one sentence you wrote, though.

 

Do you mean you're *USING* Triacetone Triperoxide (I assume you meant Triacetone Peroxide when you said TATP) for pyro applications?!?!

 

Or did you mean that you only *write* AP when you mean TATP, in the forums?

 

M

 

 

P.S. If anyone's curious about TATP, see this link: http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/sys...itions/tatp.htm

[ltf]

No, we're not stupid or suicidel we don't use Triacetone Peroxide for pyro, we only wrire AP instead of TATP or Triacetone Peroxide.

and back to flash powders..

[TheSidewinder]

I didn't think so....

 

Still and all, you can see what I mean. When you use "AP" for something and I use "AP" for something else, it confuses people.

 

Yeah, back to flash powders.....

 

"Best" is subjective. I like plain old 70/30 if it's just to make noise.

 

But personally, I think flash is WAAY overused in pyro these days. Far too many booms, not enough colors and effects. I like a good salute as much as the next guy, but not 1000 of them in succession. And it seems everyone's trying to set the record for noise, and ignoring the record for "Damn-Good-Looking" shells. This, too, shall pass...

 

M

[Dr Boom]

I've heard a bit about the whole "best flash thing" and I do think it's very important for the healthy progression of a good pyrotechnist. While trying to reduce "flash" effects from pyrotechnic displays may leave a crowd wanting more heart-stopping thunder over there heads, trying to cut it out completely will more then likely not satisfy those hard core pyros such as us that live for the smoke, color AND concussive booms that keep our eyes wide for moments after the effect.

 

I've done a few indoor pyro effects for schools and plays, football games and hosted a couple town shoots for the 4th of July- the 3 things to keep in mind when using/ selecting flash effects are:

 

1- Safety to the spectators

2- Target group of on-lookers

3- Appropriate placement in the production

 

(Now, before you read too far know that I intend to elaborate on the subject of using flash effects before you get the prize cookie of my best formula, patience my friends)

 

1- First thing is the most important and so much more in close proximity effects. You need to know how little of a material to use will still get you the desired affect. When you start going over-board just because you have some powder left or start looking for non-entertainment uses for it, you've gone beyond the pyrotechnic value of the art. NO-NO N-O

 

2- I'm sure you would want a bunch of salutes showering from shells at your grandma's 80th birthday or say your little sister's slumber pyro-party- not! Know what kind of display your target group 'wants' to see. If you have a bunch of mothers with kids, you'll more then likely want to do more colorful items, multiple effect fountains and so forth. 'Maybe' throw in one or two small salute items but don't make the noise the center of attention.

 

3- Ok, you've got your crowd gathered. They are your friends and family and they know what caliber of a pyro you are. You want to dazzle them! Yes...but not over kill. A chain of salutes just dulls your senses to other more delicate items that either last longer or offer more in a pyrotechnic display.

Don't start off with salutes for one; you want to savor those moments where everyone is awed by the complexity of a 6 or 8 inch willow shell effect and then, BAMM! That heart stopping moment where everyone looks at one another with a startled expression and then the laughter from each other's faces.

 

* For the purpose of storage, safety and ease to make I've developed the following composition:

 

7- Potassium Perchlorate

1- Calcium Carbonate

3- Aluminum (any air-float will do)

1- Antimony Trisulfide (Chinese needle if you can get it)

 

All these components are mixed by volume, i.e. - 1 tsp SbS3, 3 tsp Al, etc. etc.

 

Mix the two metal powders first and then separately mix the Carbonate and Potassium Perchlorate

 

Gently mix these two products to get the end compound that is both safe in a shell and also in short-Medium term storage. I gauge short term as a few days or weeks, Med-term as months to a year or slightly more. It is very fast, bright and is equally awesome in the air or on the ground. The addition of Dextrin or shellac to the mixture by about 20% and moistened with alcohol or water (depending on the binder), mixed to the consistency of dough and gently pressed over a cheese grater or similar large hole screen will produce an excellent break grain for color shells and has a wide range of uses in other effects.

 

Sorry if this got a bit long winded but I feel if I make a post it needs to be a good one- yall have fun and be safe!

[pa_pyro]

Measuring by volume? And last I knew there was no such thing as airfloat aluminum...Still good ideas for putting on a show though.

[optimus]

I think he means any kind of Aluminium that will float in the air, so anything finer than around 300mesh flake - mabye slightly coarser even...

[Dr Boom]

Ah sorry guys for the confusion there, when I say "air float" for aluminum it's a general term I use for any aluminum powder that will "cloud" when tossed into the air.

Acceptable meshes/microns are:

 

350, 400, 500, 800 mesh, atomized, 1, 2, 3, 4 micron-

 

As a rule of thumb for this composition, anything finer then 350 mesh.

[weknowpyro]

The best flash i have come across recently is Kclo4 and MgAl in a 50:50 mix. This makes a nice flash and is extremly powerful so i really do use small amounts i.e under a gram.

[cplmac]

I recently tested 5 mixes, and the winner was:

 

Pot Perch 5 mic ..... 7

German Black 3 mic ... 3

Sulfur Flour ............. 1

Cab-O-Sil ............... .1

 

This mix was the loudest, noticeably louder than the 7/3 Perch/German mix. Although the 7/3 mix did have a deeper sound. The flash on both was very bright considering there was no Mag in the mix.

[ltf]

Isn't it risky to mix perch with S? I have no experience with perch and chlorates but I've allways been told not to mix them with solfur..

[shadopyro]

Only unsafe to mix chlorates with sulphur, perchlorates are more stable than chlorates therefore its safer.

...though in my mind there isnt much point adding sulphur to an already powerful flash powder.

[Mumbles]

Actually, sulfur with perchlorate is just as unsafe as with chlorates. I've been trying to tell that to people for years, but no one listens. It's friction, impact, and overal stability is just an eyelash better than with chlorate. The slight decrease in sensitivity mainly comes from the higher ignition temperature.

[shadopyro]

Wow! i've always thought that perchlorate were far safer. Quite shocking how i didnt realise this! Good thing i never add sulphur to flash powders anyway then!

Sorry about that last reply.

[FrankRizzo]

If you want to prove it to yourself, just grind a *tiny* bit of potassium perchlorate and sulfur with a mortar and pestle. You have to apply a bit more pressure, but it'll snap crackle and pop just like chlorate does.

[pyrochris]

If you want to prove it to yourself, just grind a *tiny* bit of potassium perchlorate and sulfur with a mortar and pestle. You have to apply a bit more pressure, but it'll snap crackle and pop just like chlorate does.

*goes and does this with a pound of flash* LOL, just kidding. This is almost as dangerous as H3.

[pa_pyro]

If you want the "most powerful" flash I would say pot. permanganate and extremely fine mesh magnalium. *Im talking in power, not safety.* I've never made more than a gram of this stuff and in small amounts(1 grain, or one fifteenth of a gram, maybe closer to a tenth of a gram) it has self confined. It didn't make that loud of a bang but the pie pan it was on dented and there was a loud pop.

[Grizzly]

If you want the "most powerful" flash I would say pot. permanganate and extremely fine mesh magnalium. *Im talking in power, not safety.* I've never made more than a gram of this stuff and in small amounts(1 grain, or one fifteenth of a gram, maybe closer to a tenth of a gram) it has self confined. It didn't make that loud of a bang but the pie pan it was on dented and there was a loud pop.

Whoa KMnO4/MgAl??? that should have exploded unconfined as my bad ratios KClO4/MgAl exploded unconfined in a very small amount, not sure how much. Heres a video of it unconfined http://www.zshare.net/video/kclo4mgal-flas...d-test-mpg.html. I dont why it was sparking before it exploded I guess it was pieces of the MgAl burning on the paper. The thing I notcied with KClO4/MgAl is that it degrades very badly within a few days, I had problems with it igniting and then when it did it burnt slow. Do u have a video of this KMnO4/MgAl? And as for the best Flash Powder I found is of course KClO4/Al.

[pa_pyro]

I'll try to get a video in soon. In the vid i will be burning 1/10 of a gram unconfined kmno4/600 mesh mg/al.

 

http://www.zshare.net/video/000_0001-mov.html

 

here it is.(the flash lit before the fuse did)

 

If the video isn't working save it 1st

[cplmac]

THose both look pretty potent. I have never used permangenate because I hae heard it degrades real fast. I have some 500 mesh magnaliium, I think I'm gonna add some to my Cab-O-Sil mix. I'll keep you posted.

[Grizzly]

Nice man, that didint explode unconfined? the KClO4/MgAl I did on that video was a lil less then what u used.

[pa_pyro]

Didn't self confine? From the distance I was it was pretty loud.

[Grizzly]

Didn't self confine? From the distance I was it was pretty loud.

lol What I meant was u said it just made a pop when u did it before but this time it look like it did self confine.

[pa_pyro]

Oops my mistake just guessing on the amounts, before i just put tiny piles on the pan I didn't weigh out the amount.(tryin to see how small of a pile I could get to pop pretty much worked in any amount)

[Chemguy]

You can make a fairly usefull gunpowder fom Sulfur and HTH (calcium hypochlorite), it is dangerous as it can self combust.

I leart that the hard way

[Pretty green flame]

Now why would anyone here want to make something that dangerous when the standard BP formula works just fine and is relatively safe.

 

Dumb!