asilentbob Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 "Secure Handling of Ammonium Nitrate Act of 2007"Its happening. Slipped in in 2007. Before (July 31, 2005):http://www.globalsecurity.org/org/ne...ror-threat.htm Thursday, April 26, 2007:http://homeland.house.gov/issues/ind...&PublishDate=0 Oct 23, 2007:"This bill passed in the House of Representatives by voice vote. A record of each representative's position was not kept."http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h110-1680 Last action:Oct 24, 2007: Received in the Senate and Read twice and referred to the Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs. FULL BILL:http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill...bill=h110-1680 At this point it only needs to be voted on by the senate and signed by the president. Its quite obvious for anyone to see that it will be law very soon. We all know how sheeple react to anti-terrorist legislation... And between that and bush... Yeah its gunna get passed and hobby chemists and rocket guys who use AN properly are gunna get raped. There is too much to go into and it could still change a little before it is law. From PML (Pyrotechnics Mailing List):(Thus far. There are bound to be many more replies.) ">News flash. In the closing minutes of 2007 congress quietly passed>(as part of a Bush Administration appropriations bill) the Ammonium>Nitrate Security Act of 2007. The bill requires all purchasers of>ammonium nitrate to obtain a license from the Department of Homeland>Security. There is a $ 50K fine for illegal possession. Apparently>the details have not been completely worked out yet, but there does>not appear to be any small quantity exemption as originally proposed>in April of last year. Originally there was an exemption for 2,000>lb or less. Not anymore. So if you want AN to fertilize you lawn>call DHS..........>Check it out on google.." "Thanks for the heads up. My guess is that they will requirean ATF Type 20 permit to purchase AN. That is going to makethings difficult for the high-power rocketry folks. Here issome more info on this (ridiculous knee jerk) law: http://tinyurl.com/yot7vn I see this law having two undesirable side effects based onthe farmers that use most of this stuff: 1) a lot more farmersare going to be getting Type 20 permits, which will createbigger problems for the ATF, and 2) the market for AN willdecline for those farmers that decide AN is too much hassleand opt for anhydrous ammonia instead (which will become abigger problem for the DEA and EPA). And the rocket folkscan pretty much cross PBAN off their propellant list." Why should we care:Its a great fertilizer. Chances are that you and many of your neighbors use mixes containing a pretty good fraction of it without even knowing it. Ever wandered about AN/urethane and other composite propellants? Well its getting harder and harder to experiment with them... and its only getting worse. Ever had any chemical reactions that worked well specifically because they contained ammonium nitrate rather than say potassium nitrate? There are so many experiments out there that use it. And I'm not talking explosives. KEEP HIGH EXPLOSIVES OUT OF THE DISCUSSION PLEASE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oskarchem Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 Oh well, I guess that will come eventually into action in France, so I will have to stock up on it... But in the law it dosen't say that possesion of cold packs with contain AN is illegal.. EDIT: today I saw massive packs of AN (600kg)... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeAdFX Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 Besides the fact of amateur scientists and ragheads gettin fucked over, the general population will get fucked over too. Food prices are going to go up I wonder how long walmart can support those low prices when alternative fertilizers have to be used. I guess some law maker forgot to realize that the reason why we can support such a large population is because of fertilizers. O well when a famine hits the US I have a feeling these same ignorant fuckwads will blame farmers. Honestly I believe this is something that can be solved. Food is essential for survival so I am pretty certain a majority of the population could be convinced to go against this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asilentbob Posted January 22, 2008 Author Share Posted January 22, 2008 Yeah... However it is nearly in already... and the public at large doesn't know about it... and if the news covers it... they will do so in such a way to make it seem a smart move that will protect all of us that much more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacob Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 This is so idiotic, does it apply to ALL purchasers? even little old ladys who might only want a pound or two for their Tomatoes? also, do you know anything about how it will effect pre-law Nitrate possesers? is the Nitrate Gestapo going to come around handing out 50k fines and confiscating all traces of it or what.I can't belleve that almost no one has heard of this. (well, with our country i guess i can ) looks like i'll have to stock up soon, maybe the government has finally dug itself a hole it can't get out of, but i doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarezWally Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 Already banned here due to some shit that happened in another country, although your supposed to have a permit depending where you go and what you look like you may be able to get a bag or two. It sucks, and the shit thing is it wont stop the 'evil dooers' as they will just steal it or get a bloody permit and blow us to bits regardless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asilentbob Posted January 23, 2008 Author Share Posted January 23, 2008 As I said over at totsebb... somewhat... When it comes to small amounts it will likely be handled like coffee machines in Texas... Technically they are illegal because the have a Pyrex flask (not supposed to own lab glass without license), and they have a hot plate (not supposed to own lab equipment without license)... but no one knows this... so coffee machines continue to be sold and no law enforcement officer thinks twice, let alone once about it... but... technically they could fine you for it... you could probably get it dismissed as it is quite outrageous... but that in conjunction with common household chemicals would likely not get dismissed... if they happened to want to take you down in particular for whatever reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarezWally Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 Your not allowed to own lab gear in Texas? What a fun place you must live in, feel free to have a gun rack in your car but get arrested for having a test tube. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psyco_1322 Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 Damn thats fucked up. A license for labware? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asilentbob Posted January 23, 2008 Author Share Posted January 23, 2008 Texas has had a very aggressive stance on this because they really hate meth labs. ... but with all the people coming in from down south with no money... meth labs are inevitable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cplmac Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 Better get it now, they won't be chasing down purchases from before the law went into effect, and they won't be able to fine those who bought it beforehand. Chances are the high powered rocketry lobby will get an exemption worked in here, this bill is nowhere near done. Getting anything through the Senate is like passing stones. And chances are the bill the Senate passes will not jive with the bill the House passed and there will be plenty of bickering in committee, and lets not forget the main bill it's piggy backing, any appropriations bill is a war in todays congress. On the down side, this is exactly the kind of issue that is conceded in a bill to pass a bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psyco_1322 Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 I bet Kansas has more meth labs than Texas. We are up on the top of the list of meth capitals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mardec Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 Let's ban glassware, let's ban one of the most common chemicals on the planet, why not burn all science books and ban science and intellect alltogether. God bless America. Very soon you must remove bird shit withing 5 minutes from the moment of dropping. Otherwise you will get arrested for holding a nitrate salt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAP Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Ban things readly available here and smugglers bring it across the borders in semi's. There is no total ban, prohibition proved that in the twentys. I get sick of big brother breathing down my neck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oskarchem Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Yeah, I meen if someone *REALLY* wants to blow somthing up and they won't have acces to AN, Flash powders or stuff like that, they will start going to other more dangerous things (like high explosives). Here in France pentaerythritol is sold as a laxatif... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGM Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 I'm pretty sure that Oregon has the most meth labs in the U.S., and per city, I heard that Jefferson WI (just down the road from me) is the highest. Perhaps in the chemistry section there could be a thread dealing with the production of ammonium nitrate. On ebay, there is some guide for sale on how to make your own. Maybe I'll get it to see if it has any merit, its only about 4 bucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mormanman Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Ban things readly available here and smugglers bring it across the borders in semi's. There is no total ban, prohibition proved that in the twentys. I get sick of big brother breathing down my neck. LOL. Me and my friend, he is inactive on this site now, Coolerguy09 we talk about the government in the same way and how we're becoming a police state.There is no more privicy in this country anymore. I'm still suprised some books you can still read at school "knock on wood." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarezWally Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 The home production of ammonium nitrate is not worth it, unless you get your hands on a lot of nitric acid for cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mardec Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Here in France pentaerythritol is sold as a laxatif... Brings a whole new meaning to the words "explosive diarea" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAP Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 I was born in the Granola state, CA, it used to be all orchards and firework stands on every corner for the fourth. Now sparklers are BAD and outlawed. I am grateful for the ability to have access to sites like this now. and the freedom of speech. I can make my own sparklers , go hide ,and light them. Yeah! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oskarchem Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Guys; a ATF-20 permit would be what? Autherisation for making high explosives? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGM Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 In the U.S., yes. A high explosives manufacturing permit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oskarchem Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Heh, well now isin't is going to be more troublesome for the US governement if evry farmer will have a Explosive making permit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primordial Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 well maybe it's just me, but i don't think it's gonna be that big a deal... maybe my bosses know something I dont, but i work at a golf course that gets half a ton of AN at a time and they haven't said a thing about this... and i KNOW they know about it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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