Guest Mark_the_pyro Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 As many of you know, youtube is overrun by videos of "home made bombs," and idiots severely misusing fireworks, such as this example:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mqo9TRjtO_o Whenever one of us comes across a video like this, it should be an expectation to either give them a friendly PM letting them know about the ATF searching on there for these very videos (realize you IP is logged there too....), or for the idiots who wouldn't listen to that, acting like the ATF or some other entity to scare them. You hear on the news around the 4th of all the videos on the internet of the roman candle wars and such, and obviously that really hurts the pyro community in all aspects. By doing this, it indirectly will greatly benefit us all. Even if you PM one person a day, it will be one less video online for someone to bitch about, or refer to. Who is with me? So far, I have removed about 10 videos in the last few days; such examples include lighting 1.3 (with serials shown in the video), vandalism with salute shells (1.3), and the rest idiots <15 making crude "bombs." Many of these people do not know the repercussions of filming, let alone doing these stupid things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarezWally Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 Well considering they have a European accent im willing to bet they do not reside in the USA so the ATF has no jurisdiction over them anyway. Best you can do is to get youtube to remove the videos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mark_the_pyro Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 Well I am just saying in general, and that video is one example. Regardless of country, I am sure the CPSC still considers it ammunition for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarezWally Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 One kid was even stupid enough to test his new boomer in his skylighter box, he got blasted in the comments for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flying fish Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 God, I hope youtube does not become the downfall of our hobby. I have a few questions: - Isn't posing as an authority such as an ATF agent over the internet illegal? I know it is in "real life", but wouldn't you think those rules may also apply to the internet? That being said, if it didn't involve getting in trouble I would love to scare people out of posting irresponsible firework videos! Perhaps you could just "make up" some agency rather than saying you are from the BATF. I would otherwise resort to the semi-friendly PM to let them know who they are hurting by posting the videos. - Do the ATF (or other authorities) really track down people based on youtube "bomb" videos? I would be interested to learn about actual cases of this happening. - Though we here focus on the artform of responsible pyrotechnics, it is likely that some of us are bending/breaking certain laws in order to pursue our hobby. So...should WE refrain from posting our videos on youtube? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazyboy25 Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 well mark the pyro although i applaud your attempts to "preserve or hobby" in the eyes of the ATFE our "art" and their careless stupid bomb making are not different AT ALL both require a license and both without a license ARE TOTALLY ILLEGAL your intentions intentions are good in reality its not achieving anything whatsoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mark_the_pyro Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 To answer your questions flying fish. -To my knowledge no, it is not illegal to pose as whoever on the internet; and even if you were to be taken to court (you would have to do something blatantly stupid to have this happen), all you would say is "I was trying to discourage him from doing illegal activities." I am sure that would sound very good in the courtroom. -Yes, it is true the ATF track people down that do this. I am not sure of the specifics, but they do have a special online branch where all they do is find content like this. And obviously, youtube will give them the user's IP in a heartbeat to avoid lawsuits and to comply. I will not mention his name, but a member on this forum (I think, other forums for sure though), he posted at least a dozen salute videos on his youtube account, ranging from m-80's, to full sticks, including one of which that was lit right behind a police station, which certainly did not help matters. So a few weeks after he posted them, early on a saturday morning, his household was awoken by several ATF agents with a warrant at his front door. They confiscated ALL of his chemicals (of which I believe he had upwards of 100lbs of perc), and he had to sign a paper saying he would never touch any 1.4g, 1.3g, or any pyrotechnic components ever again, otherwise he would go to prison. Additionally, he worked for a display company, and was obviously fired from there as well. In my honest opinion I personally have no problems with people making salutes. If you want to make them, fine; use them responsibly, cover your ass, don't post videos of you being an idiot on video hosting sites. -Consider what kind of videos the CPSC and other nanny groups look for. "Bombs," and irresponsible use of both legal and illegal fireworks. How often do you see beautiful clips of home-made shells in their propaganda reels? Never. I feel people should not have to worry if they are filming using their fireworks in responsible ways, and not just filming only the salutes they created. That way, it would show the viewers our hobby is not about "bombs" and loud noises, and that there is art, beauty, and creativity in everything that we make. EDIT regarding crazyboy: This is not a matter of legality, but more the image the pyrotechnic community gives off. And sadly, the "bomb makerz" and other pyro-idiots on youtube usually get grouped with us. It is the removal of this detrimental factor, that will make us look *much* better in the eyes of others. Sure, there might not be any laws outlawing roman candle wars, or throwing mortar shells, but regardless, it still does shine a negative light on us all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tentacles Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 Mark: I like the effort, but for your own sake, consider: it IS a federal crime to impersonate a federal officer - I'm certain the judge would consider your wish to deter illegal activities into consideration. BUT the judge would have you there for YOUR crime, and the couple of judges I've seen, for small matters (once, driving w/o insurance, and once to get a restraining order) were grumpy, no-nonsense sorts at best, and when you get federal circuit courts, they can be real bastards - and compared to a lot of people they see, you would be an easy target. I think you could come off sounding official, without actually claiming any such thing, and that would possibly be the best course. A warning, maybe a copy of the latest orange book PDF, and a suggestion to "read over the new storage magazine and process facility regulations" and consult their local ATFE officer for re-inspection. Or somesuch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asilentbob Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 In the past i have emailed posters on forums who have talked about making bombs and such and told them how it hurt our hobby. Unfortunately most of them don't give a shit and will invent any retort that they can to try to look like they know what they are doing. When my friends start talking about anarchist cookbook type crap i straight up tell them that they shouldn't believe a bit of it. I tell them how long i have been into serious pyrotechnics and that if they are ever seriously wanting to do something, to check with me first so that i can make sure that they do it safely and responsibly, if at all. Its really a hard battle though... we have so many groups to fight against. There are so many sources of bad information, bad ideas, misinformation, etc that in all reality will not ever die... the ACB for example. Yeah i pretty much started there like so many others, but man how nice it would have been to get something truly informative relating to real pyrotechnics whenever i entered whatever those fateful first google search terms were at the time... Now if you can remove such crap sites like the ACB forum site, and the copies from other sites... then great! Too bad it will never happen. The people that host the copies do so because of their strong belief in free information. Never mind if its dangerously incorrect. Don't get me wrong, i like information from old books thats readily available online. All for the Guttenberg (sp) project... but when noob/kewls come across that link to the ACB there should really be a note stating something like:"Just FYI the ACB is 98.5% crap... if you really want to learn pyrotechnics you should read up here (some websites and modern books listed) instead. This copy of the ACB is only here for history's sake... Take it with a grain of salt of ridiculously small size." Actually... some website owners might be ok with that... so its a possibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightHawkInLight Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 tentacles:"I think you could come off sounding official, without actually claiming any such thing, and that would possibly be the best course. A warning, maybe a copy of the latest orange book PDF, and a suggestion to "read over the new storage magazine and process facility regulations" and consult their local ATFE officer for re-inspection. Or somesuch." Great idea, I think that may even give a scare to a fully licensed person! Personally I have sent PMs to several people asking them to remove some of their videos explaining that it puts out a bad reputation. Most times after further explaining they will remove the video in question. Even the 12 year old kid with a 1.4g shell can usually see reason in not wanting to make fireworks less available. Mind you there are some people out there whose minds are far beyond repair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tweetybird88 Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 So after saying all this do we really want this as our "theme" video? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NsM49YSp5Us Truthfully I try to reason with the people that post videos like Bo0o0o0o0M! on youtube but they usually don't listen to me. A couple of times I've flamed them bad but I try to control my frustration. I still get people that go up to me at school and say "I'll pay you $20000 if you blow up so and so" I'm just afraid someone will get the wrong idea and I'll get to hear my mom say "son, someone named atf is on the phone for you." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 That video was made a lot time ago, and while we were still developing into what we are now. If someone wants to make a new video, with say some competition entries, and basically the archive of CPL's file host, be my guest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mark_the_pyro Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 Yeah, and lets not use the "teenage rebel" music for next video. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FUZE Posted October 18, 2007 Share Posted October 18, 2007 Hi guys I havent been on APC if forever but always im practicing my hobby since the topic of youtube came up I wonna post how extremly retarded some of the "new" generatin are here is a link of a complete idiot. He loaded a PVC pipe with AP and decided to hand light it....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9fszHpbgwv4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boomer Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 What happened to him? It says "file has been removed". Yeah good idea but why only this one??? Or maybe they should leave *only* the accidents online, with pre/after-hospital pics included... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rev.redneck Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 i read the terms of use on youtube, it says "Don't post videos showing dangerous or illegal acts, like animal abuse, drug abuse, or bomb making" therefore flag it as "inappropriate", youtube says they review them and remove vids if it is inappropriate such as, er, bomb making.i will try a few to see what happens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rev.redneck Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 Well, so far youtube has removed 1 out of 3 vids i flagged as innapropriat* spelling.. i think they pulled it because it showed details of how they made it.. maybe get ride of some of the dumb stuff that way, who knows, might be worth trying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oskarchem Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 what can you do about it?? Some people are just freakin stupid... Like I saw the other day a guy putting 100g of AP in a copper tube (no comment) and then detonationg it on a peice of ply wood (no comment either)...Shame I dident Flag it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FUZE Posted October 25, 2007 Share Posted October 25, 2007 the kid in the vid i posted had shrapnel in his torso and hand but was still alive....which is kinda a shame one less idiot is another idiot saved Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted October 25, 2007 Share Posted October 25, 2007 I'd obviously prefer these people to stay alive. Perhaps they'll learn their lesson and smarten up, or find a new hoppy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h0lx Posted November 11, 2007 Share Posted November 11, 2007 Deleting stuff from youtube doesen't do jack shit either they are archived on another site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrankRizzo Posted November 11, 2007 Share Posted November 11, 2007 But unless the CPSC has a bunch of perve....err..nevermind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJPork Posted November 11, 2007 Share Posted November 11, 2007 I personally l3elieve that removing these vidoes won't do much. It's not only that vidoes of this nature are posted l3y these duml3asses more often than can possil3ly l3e removed l3y a handfull of people. l3esides, it's not so much these youtul3e videos that give us a l3ad reputation, l3ut the cases where people do end up seriously injured or killed. People are always gonna want to see things go l3oom, and the way I see it, the only difference l3etween somel3ody who makes an M80 out of a cardl3oard tul3e and exercises the nesacary safety precautions and somel3ody who throws some flashpowder or smokeless powder into a metal pipe is lack of knowledge (not stupidity). If they knew how dangerous what they are doing is, l3y far the majority wouldn't keep making these dangerous devices. Flaming isn't the answer, education is. (The l3utton on my keyl3oard surronded l3y V,G,H and N is currently l3roken, in case you hadn't already noticed). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
batman Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 It is good to see that when i look through this topic that the majority of the video links of these foolish people have been removed. Personally i do believe by having these videos removed from any where which shows people being irresponsible, careless and stupid will be a great start, if enough people put in the effort i think it would make a good start, anything that gives the pyrotechnic hobby a bad name will be better off if its not there to start with. When i am watching the news, i tend to see video evidence of something that has happened, for example someone being irresponsible by making a home mad explosive device and posting it on youtube and they have a whole topic on it, this gives the media or authorities ammo to give this hobby a bad name, but if the video wasnt there in the first place or had be removed before it was found i think it would help and it does all add up, any way thats my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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