All10Fingers Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 This is my second one ever over 1inch. And I'm still in shock it even worked. It was supposed to have some more red in it. But the blue and green came out beautiful. An the break wasn't symmetrical, but that really wasn't my focus when I was building her. I do spend more time than I'd like to admit tracing and cutting out paper circles and it's the most tedious part of the whole process. I know there's got to be a better way but I haven't found it. Also, fiberglass reinforced packing tape is awesome VID_20240318_212829825.mp4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zumber Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 Thats nice shell.! Did you spiked shell? What was burst? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All10Fingers Posted March 19 Author Share Posted March 19 It was spiked with tape, the burst was BP coated rice crispy in the center and regular BP around the stars. Lift was 45 grams of corned bp. The spolets was hammered and installed off center to make it spin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zumber Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 Star looks irregular? Why not just round or pumped ? Keep it up and practice... good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All10Fingers Posted March 19 Author Share Posted March 19 The stars are a mix of leftovers from test batches of different colors. All I do is push the wet mix flat in a table with my hand and do my left handed best to cut some straight lines in it. If the test stars look good I'll make more and take the time to make em pretty. But I've only made 2 so I haven't needed anymore yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zumber Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 Alright.🙂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richtee Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 Perfect breaks are a thing you chase for ever. Well, I did. Dang, nice bust for BP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingkama Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 (edited) The cloth tape you used is not suitable for tying, you need to use cotton or hemp twine, the split is discreet but requires at least a little Booster, the spolette still goes to the center and the spinning will still be there. Excellent powder for lift and timing of the fuze. Edited March 19 by kingkama Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All10Fingers Posted March 19 Author Share Posted March 19 I used the tape because the shell as it was already fit perfectly in the mortar and string would of made it too big. I plan to make more soon. What sort of booster do you recommend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sulphurstan Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 For booster, I personally use KBenzo 30 + KP 70, with a little dextrin, and then screened and dried to have some small 'granules' (~ 1 mm in size). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All10Fingers Posted March 19 Author Share Posted March 19 Would using pure BP instead of coated rice cereal serve the same function as a booster? Maybe with a pinch of aluminum sprinkled in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbo Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 Fiber tape can be an acceptable substitute for twine and has been used by several accomplished shell builders. However, they use it in 1/8" and 1/4" widths so it can be mimic the distribution of regular spiking patterns. "Non-traditional" materials often need old techniques adjusted to each new material's peculiarities and that takes time and effort. Most new to fireworking typically use traditional materials and techniques since everything has (mostly) already been figured out for them and they get satisfactory results sooner. You might progress faster if you get an appropriately-sized case former... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All10Fingers Posted March 19 Author Share Posted March 19 I've been using a smaller mortar tube, but I just got an old fashioned rolling pin I was gonna try. I feel there's a number of items that would greatly improve my progress in the field. Except for a few chemicals and metal powders, I source everything from dumpsters, discarded scrap piles and the dollar tree. I would love to get some star plates, rocket spindles, case formers and a proper set of screens. Maybe someday when people get over themselves and stop charging extortionate prices for a chunk of aluminum smaller than a water bottle. I did just this weekend score a 30 ton hydraulic press and a one ton manual arbor press, so I'm a little closer. Then again, I cut fuse with scissors so I probably won't live to see 40 if you believe some people on this site Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richtee Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 2 hours ago, All10Fingers said: Then again, I cut fuse with scissors so I probably won't live to see 40 if you believe some people on this site I'll soon be 61 and if I don’t use a set of linesman's pliers, it’s scissors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richtee Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Oh..and an email from a guy who prolly saved all my 10 fingers. He’s passed on now. Uh...naturally and in one piece. RIP Jimbo. Rich, If all you’re doing is lifting small shells, up to 4”, then FFG or FFFG is just fine. You can mix it 50 / 50 with your homemade BP and it will work just fine too and save you some money. The rule of thumb is if your lift powder is too weak, you just use more of it. You can also make BenzoLift, but it’s more expensive (uses up your perc) and its overly powerful to my mind, I’ve had it detonate flash shells just from the setback in the pipe when used at 100%. It can be blended in a smaller % to increase the power of weak BP, just like adding some commercial GOEX FFFG would do. The best answer though is for you to build a better ball mill to make better BP to start with. If you’re able to obtain a CATO in a nozzle less rocket using your BP, it should have plenty of power for a lift charge though. My last question then would be to ask if you’re corning your powder, or at least wetting and screening it prior to using it for lift. That makes a hell of a difference over using right out of the mill proverone. Note, you do know never to mix a chlorate with any sulfur containing powder right? That is unless you want to die…. Jimbo BenzoLift BenzoLift is essentially whistle mix that is diluted with black powder. If made correctly, Benzolift can be very powerful. Be careful - it can be two or more times as powerful as commercial BP and seems to be the answer to the weaknesses of homemade BP - that is, the stuff is powerful enough that you don't have to make charcoal from hard-to-get woods to make a good lift powder. Normal BP made from Skylighter airfloat charcoal makes great Benzolift (about twice as strong as Elephant brand 2fg). In addition, it doesn't take too long to make and it is cheaper than commercial BP. It might be a bit more expensive than homemade BP although that might not be true when you factor in the efficiencies of using it. Here is a link to how to make simple Benzolift safely: benzolift.html. If you decide to make it, then stay consistent on your process from batch to batch - minor changes in process can affect the power of Benzolift quite a lot. There is probably no reason to use Benzolift for lifting large shells - Benzolift is in the 3" and less territory! One thing I have noticed - it 'slams' the shell harder than BP does. Specifically, a 3 gram charge of Benzolift in a Double-Voice Cracker will destroy the cracker on the ground - 3 grams of very hot BP will lift it into the air the way it is supposed to. Both these charges, when used in a mortar, lift the shell about the same height. Since it is much easier to make Benzolift than hot BP (especially if one can't get/make the correct charcoals), here are some small diameter rules of thumb for lift quantities that I go by (your mileage and cardboard shrapnel may vary): 1.5 to 1.75" - 2 grams of Benzolift 2" - 2.5 grams to 3 grams 3" - 5 grams Over 3" - don't use Benzolift - use BP. Even poor lift powder can often be used for larger mortars. Making Benzolift I've decided that Benzolift is much safer for me to make than whistle or flash and can be used as a substitute for either of them for breaking shells and making small salutes. HOWEVER - Don't take my word for it. You should decide if you want to use Benzolift and whether it is safe for you. I'm not the originator of Benzolift - indeed, a couple of us have been trying to find out who it was so we can give credit. The nearest I can tell, a guy/gal named Espinella posted the formula first in 1998 but that is unconfirmed. If you know, email me (my address is on the index page - http://www.wichitabuggywhip.com/fireworks ) Here is my way of making it - hopefully, the result is both safer and more effective than previously described techniques. BenzoLift is a relatively recent addition to the pyro's formula base. It is a vigorous burning powder that does not detonate in small batches. Benzolift can be loosely defined as an homogenous mixture of 70% whistle and 30% BP. However, the mixture is quite carefully produced so that the dangers of making a whistle mixture are reduced. Above is 100 grams of Benzolift in a plastic tub This is the shot - it looks worse than it was This is the tub afterwards. It wasn't in too bad shape. To test the 'does not detonate' claim, I decided to burn a batch of it to see if it would self-contain. The above pictures illustrate a a test of 100 grams of material - the Benzolift simply burned with a 'whump'. Note that not a lot of testing has been done with Benzolift and any numbers or results quoted (including the propensity to detonate as illustrated above) may be wrong in the general case. It is important that you follow instructions and use caution. Various explanations of how to make Benzolift have said you could just use BP ingredients and not have to use finished meal or ball milled BP to make it. When I first experimented with making Benzolift this way, I had trouble with the results - the Benzolift was always poor quality. After a bit of experimenting, I think I stumbled onto a way to make very good Benzolift that is quite safe during mixing, and that can be made from scratch in about 20 minutes (not counting drying time). The trick is to mix the ingredients in stages and mix them very thoroughly. Read on! Use the following chemicals to make a 330 gram batch (which is plenty for most of us hobbyists). There is no dextrin in this version of Benzolift. When made according to the instructions, the grains will be quite crunchy and sturdy. 1. Charcoal – 15 grams (Skylighter airfloat works fine) 2. Potassium Nitrate – 75 grams 3. Sulfur – 10 grams 4. Sodium Salicylate – 70 grams ( you might try substituting potassium or sodium benzoate - but best results are with salicylate) 5. Potassium Perchlorate – 160 grams Those who know pyro/chemistry know that the above chemicals could be combined into some pretty powerful mixes that would be quite dangerous. One goal in the mixing of these materials was to make the process safer. To do that, the mixture was kept very wet from the beginning right up to the last drying stage. It was so wet that there was no stage of mixing that would support ignition until after the first drying. When mixing, be sure that each stage is complete with no 'dregs' of chemicals on the sides of the bowl or spoon. Everything should be uniformly mixed before going to the next stage. Stage one - mix the charcoal, potassium nitrate, and sulfur (screened to get the lumps out) into enough hot water to make a thin gravy. The mixture should be almost the consistency of commercial tomato soup when properly prepared. Stir this for at least 10 minutes and let sit for another five minutes or so - then stir again. The intent is to uniformly mix the ingredients - the charcoal needs to combine with the KNO3 enough to make the mix reactive when dry. The mixture should be perfectly smooth. Stage two - Add in the sodium salicylate. The mixture will still be soupy at first but will rapidly thicken up as the salicylate absorbs the moisture. The mixture should turn into an oatmeal-like mush. If it is thinner, that is ok. If it is thicker, then consider adding just a bit of water. Remember, it should be oatmeal like your mom used to make -- before the oatmeal dried on the stove. Stage three - Add in the potassium perchlorate. This will take some arm strength but you should end up with a doughy mixture that will not readily pour out of the bowl but still squeeze through your fingers like slow natives through elephant feet. It takes about five minutes of vigorous mixing to get this stage. Knead the resultant dough with your hands until it is well mixed. I use nitrile gloves to protect my hands - you can go with naked hands but it will take a while to get clean afterwards. Stage four - Spread the gooey mixture on an aluminum or non-sparking pan and make criss-cross marks in it with a spatula. Dry for a couple of hours. Crystallizing potassium nitrate will start to turn the outside of the mix white. Mix again when the consistency is heavy dough and get it uniformly colored. Dry until the mix is pretty solid, screen it once or twice – enough to make it uniform in color again. Dry for the final time. During stage four, the mix will take fire after it dries the first time but it will not be vigorous. It will only be dangerous after it is dried the last time. I wanted to relate all this because the result was some very good Benzolift and it was done without too much hassle – and no ball milling. Previous attempts to make it with green mix involved combining all the ingredients except the perc and then adding in water - the mixing was unsatisfactory and the result was inferior in all ways Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richtee Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 "but still squeeze through your fingers like slow natives through elephant feet.” 🤣 I miss Jim. He had a way with chems AND words Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All10Fingers Posted March 20 Author Share Posted March 20 Finally a helpful response. Thank rich... And Jimbo. I think my BP is pretty good. I've never used it even seen commercial powder of any kind. But I can say it will definitely cato a nozzle less rocket if I don't dilute it with extra fuel. And if I use anything but the largest particle size I have, it flowerpots even the little shells. Again I have no frame of reference to compare it against. But it makes an audible thump and leave a piece of paper unscorched in it burn test. (I got video if interested. I keep recalling one of my first rockets. It has a one inch plastic hemisphere on top. It catod, but it was the most impressive break in ever seen from such a tiny package. I don't know what I did different and haven't been able to get that scale of performance from bigger devices. (I have that video too) Maybe next time I make an order I'll get me some that benzo... Stuff. If not for booster then maybe for whistle. Then I can really piss off the neighbors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richtee Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Hey all10... here ya go. What ya got? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All10Fingers Posted March 21 Author Share Posted March 21 VID_20231025_174942795.mp4 Idk what's going on but I can't upload anything. I saw for almost 40 mins... Twice. And after it finally loaded to 100%. It says an error occurred and shuts me down. I'll keep trying. I didn't want you to think I'm ignoring you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zumber Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 (edited) You can upload youtube link. Edited March 21 by Zumber Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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