Using an Induction Cooker for making r-candy?

[stix]

I currently make my sugar rockets (melted method) using an electric skillet/frypan.

 

One of the things that really annoys me is the "ring" in the middle because it can easily caramelise the fuel and I find myself always frigging around trying to avoid the dreaded ring. There are some oil filled electric skillets on the market but they are way too expensive to justify.

 

So, I saw this today, it includes a nice pan as well - seems like a good deal. http://www.clubretail.com.au/portable-induction-cooker-with-free-pot-p458163

 

The induction method:

 

Induction cooking only works properly with cooking pans containing iron — the only metal that efficiently produces electrical (eddy) currents and heat from magnetic fields.

 

 

Sometimes I like to include red iron oxide (Fe2O3) around 2%. Does this mean there could be a possibility of the fuel igniting???. Afterall, RIO will attract to a magnet, so perhaps a big no no for the induction cooker melting method?

 

Anyone had experience - or have some scientific data or theories?

 

Cheers.

[ddewees]

Buy a rawhide mallet instead.

[deer]

We had an induction cooker very similar if not exactly the same as that one.

It's quite picky about what you put on it and can start throwing errors if there is water/grease on surface, the pot is not centered or just too small.

And AFAIK the actual temperature control was basic on/off cycling instead of some gradual throttling. So e.g. when boiling eggs in small pot, it was all of whatever kW it has transferred directly to pot, boiling so intensively water was spilling out followed by several seconds of no boiling at all.

 

Anyway. I don't recommend. Just get a hotplate with true temperature control and one, solid surface.

[GMetcalf]

I've cooked food using an induction cooker and as fancy as the idea of not being able to burn yourself with it is, it really isn't worth the hassle.

I don't think the addition of Iron Oxide would make much of a difference though.

[stix]

Buy a rawhide mallet instead.

 

Yeah, fair enough dd, I assume you are referring to dry powder pressing. A good pyro buddy of mine makes his motors that way with similar results to mine. He uses a screw press but to my mind it takes a long time (ie. all the incremental pressing... bla bla bla bla...) also he's doing them 'case bound' which I don't like. I make inhibited insertable grains - that way I can make many in an afternoon, then when required ram a nozzle, insert the grains, the header, and good to go.

 

I actually do have a hydraulic jack and steel surrounds ready to make a press but I've better things to do .

 

btw. Your comment didn't address my question

 

 

We had an induction cooker very similar if not exactly the same as that one.

It's quite picky about what you put on it and can start throwing errors if there is water/grease on surface, the pot is not centered or just too small.

And AFAIK the actual temperature control was basic on/off cycling instead of some gradual throttling. So e.g. when boiling eggs in small pot, it was all of whatever kW it has transferred directly to pot, boiling so intensively water was spilling out followed by several seconds of no boiling at all.

 

Anyway. I don't recommend. Just get a hotplate with true temperature control and one, solid surface.

 

I think this one has 10 temp control settings - maybe that would make a difference?

 

 

I've cooked food using an induction cooker and as fancy as the idea of not being able to burn yourself with it is, it really isn't worth the hassle.

I don't think the addition of Iron Oxide would make much of a difference though.

 

Ok thanks. I'm not concerned about burning myself a little bit on the fingies - I'm concerned about the fuel overcooking due to the ring on my frypan. I'd prefer a more even heat if possible.

 

Thanks guys for the input, much appreciated. I may purchase the item anyway just for scientific testing purposes, and also to give my experiences to others. I reckon I'll be the first, or perhaps the last (gulp ) to try the r-randy induction melted method

 

Cheers.

 

[Arthur]

I have heard of someone using a home bread maker for making rocket candy. Very gentle heat with mechanical stirring.

[ddewees]

I think the stirring (kneading) phase is done prior to heating (baking).

 

They make good bread though.

[Arthur]

Knowing the person, it might have been hacked to stir while warming, BUT it's still a gentle heat to a cooking bowl with heater.

[Shunt]

I picked up a portabe electric 'hotplate' as they are called in the USA at a yard sale for 5 dollars. The heating element was spiral with about 5 turns, and did produce some 'hot spots' around the spirals in the element when used with a cheap AL frypan. The solution I found was to use a heavy cast iron skillet which evens out the temperature a lot due to it's mass. Hope this helps.

[mikeee]

The hot oil cookers "FryDaddy" work well for making R-Candy, they have a temperature

control that can be adjusted to proper heat level, but you still need to stir constantly

while making the fuel.

Edited May 4, 2015 by mikeee

[nater]

If you are having problems with hot spots, why not temper the heat by using a double boiler setup?

[stix]

The hot oil cookers "FryDaddy" work well for making R-Candy, they have a temperature

control that can be adjusted to proper heat level, but you still need to stir constantly

while making the fuel.

 

Yeh thanks mike, I'm looking into a similar 2nd hand one atm on ebay.

 

If you are having problems with hot spots, why not temper the heat by using a double boiler setup?

 

I wouldn't say I'm having problems nater, it's just always been an annoyance and when I saw the add for the induction cooker I thought "woah" this may be the go.. A friend of mine has used the double boiler method (I assume you're talking using oil) It worked well but was very time consuming to set up and messy - he even rigged up his own external thermometer for accurate temperature control.

 

Thanks for all the suggestions and alternatives, but what I really wanted to know is if anyone has used an induction cooker. At this point, the answer is obviously no.

 

Cheers.

[GMetcalf]

Well all I can say from my experience using one to cook food is it does provide pretty even heat when you use a nice iron/steel pan. It also heated up surprisingly quickly - not sure how good a thing that is for cooking R-Candy though.

[stix]

Thanks GMet, I'm trying to found out more info on the temperature control specs - it has "10 grade firepower adjustment" whatever that means. I did watch a short video that mentioned Zero to Boiling in 3 seconds!!! WTF? It also mentions fine temp controls at the low end.

 

I think you're right about not wanting to heat up r-candy too quick. This device does seem appealing though. Looks cool too 'cause that's the most important factor

 

Here's the video: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/KITCHEN-COUTURE-HIGH-TECH-PORTABLE-INDUCTION-COOKER-COOK-TOP-FREE-COOKING-POT-/390864824377?_trksid=p2054897.l4275

 

[GMetcalf]

That sounds about right in terms of how quickly it heats up! I tried heating up a quinoa stir fry (look at me trying to be healthy...) and whacked it up to 9 like I would on my electric cooker at home and it was sizzling in about 15 seconds.

The temperature control really depends on the quality (and iron content) of the pan you're using. You get the best heat distribution with thick bottomed, cast iron pans. You'd get uneven heating for example, with one of those Aluminium pans which have a steel base which is thicker around the edges than the centre (a bit like the Tefal ones).

 

Having had a look at it, I would reckon go for it! It looks good and will probably work... Give it a go and let us know!

[dagabu]

The hallmark of induction heating is the speed at which it attains temperature, this is often way too much heat for the R-candy and can cause flame-overs quickly with no outward indications such as smoke etc. In cooking with fluids, induction cooking is fantastic, range tops can use pulses of power to give very gentle heating but none of the small portable units offer that, a rheostat is used to control current to the coil only. The goal then is to use the knob to ramp up the heat slowly and no overshoot your goal temp.

 

One of the many uses for PID Digital Temperature controllers is the use use of them in R-candy cooking using the above said bread makers, the system can be completely automated and the PID can keep the temp of the propellant within +- 1° F.

 

Like Nater said, an oil batch cooker is ideal for making R-candy, use Canola oil (Rapeseed) due to its incredible smoke point of 246°C, 475°F. No hot spots INCREDIBLY accurate temps with little/no variation. The use of a PID Digital Temperature Controller is EZPZ with the temp probe in the side wall of the cooker just under the cooking pan.

 

If anybody is interested in one with the PID, thermostat, Presto 06003 multicooker, let me know, I have one NIB ready for the probe and PID for $150.00 plus shipping. I have been selling them for Sous-vide cooking for some time now but they are fully capable to make R-candy as well.

 

Crockpots are great for Sous-vide cooking but lack the high end heat for deep frying or R-candy.

[stix]

Thanks guys,

 

I found this on ebay for about the same price as the induction cooker. It has an oil filled element at the base. Old but good quality and a shallow pan.

 

http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTU5OVg5MDA=/z/4nIAAOSwPYZU3qFw/$_12.JPG?set_id=880000500F

 

I still would like to give the induction cooker a go just for the sake of it but could waste my money.

 

What do you guys think - the induction or the oil filled pan?

 

I need to make a decision in the next 24hrs.

[MrB]

Oil filled, 100%

B!

[GMetcalf]

I second MrB, the oil cooker is going to probably produce the most even and reliable heating... Although I am very curious about the induction cooker! It would also have the benefit of not having any open flames or hot surfaces which could ignite the fuel...

[stix]

Thanks everyone. I just clicked the "BUY" button and purchased the oil filled pan.

 

It does somewhat leave me with a sort of hollow feeling though, because I really did want to try the induction method - and it looked so sexy (I should get out more).

 

Although the point of this post isn't really resolved, I at least know what I will have is a reliable good quality piece of equipment. It may be old, but a lot of old stuff was built to last - the induction cooker may well have been a piece of crap that worked well for a few months, and then carked it.

 

I'm so looking forward to the day I can actually touch it with my bear hands - I'll likely give it a good scrub up with some very soft steel wool... ooooooooooohhhh, shiny!!

 

Cheers.

 

I may still buy the induction cooker in the next few months just to see if the method works.

[mikeee]

If you visit Scott Fintel website he has several video tutorials that demonstrate the use of the "FryDaddy"

style hot oil cooker to make R-Candy. The company I work for supplies him with bulk quantities of Erythritol

that he uses in making R-Candy fuel for his large scale rocket motors. This alcohol-sugar has a lower melting

temperature that is closer to that of the nitrate used to make the fuel combination. His tutorials demonstrate

practical methods and easily made molds for casting the fuel grains. Making this fuel compound is easier to

produce a consistent performing rocket fuel with the lower melting temps. Most of his rockets are transported

to the Nevada desert and require federal permits to launch these larger scale rockets. Lot of good information

on his website that the average rocketeer can adapt to their motors.

[stix]

The oil filled frypan / skillet arrived today.

 

What a thing of beauty it is. Old-ish, but made very well and is able to perform with excellent results... Hang on... sorry, I was getting confused with one of those dating sites I was looking at before.

 

It's "rena-ware". I'm not sure how old it is, I did a bit of research but couldn't find much. I do know that it was made in the good old "US of A" via a stamp underneath. It has double walled stainless steel with a 1/4 inch cavity or so filled with oil. I haven't used it to make r-candy yet but did some basic tests with water and was very impressed - no dreaded hot-spot ring.

 

I sort of feel bad that I didn't go down the "induction" path, especially since I was the one who asked the question. Perhaps I should have "taken one for the team" but I certainly don't feel that bad. Rather than a piece of shit that would likely break down in a few months, I have a well made tool that will last.

 

It was originally sold with a lifetime guarantee. I'm happy that it still lives on in "stix's pyro studios" rather than possibly being thrown out.

Cheers.

[mikeee]

The newer style hot oil cookers have a teflon finish on the inside the r-candy cleans up

quickly from the surface when you are done cooking the fuel. I am sure yours will work fine

you might need to clean it up with steel wool every once in a while.

[w55561]

I use an electric skillet with a iron pot into it, it heats uniformly, and I use a infrared thermometer to monitor the temperature, which I control with a dimmer.

[MadMat]

I know it's not the best but I use an electric "hot plate" and a teflon coated sauce pan. It does have a variable control on it (not graduated in degrees though). After a few batches, I got it down pat how to adjust the control. Yeah, it's a bit more tedious, but I haven't burned a batch yet! The best part of this set up is it cost me less than ten dollars at a resale shop.