gmolsberry Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 So I have been trying to find a website to purchase potassium perchlorate formal I can make some flash for a some small binary explosive targets. I want the report to be strong and loud, while keeping the target itself small. ash is the only thing I know how to make with a big powerful "boom" while using a little amount. Also it is relatively simple to make, the components seem hard to get ahold of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pyroman2498 Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Is this HE? Not sure if it is... but if you search the forms there are other posts on explosive targets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmolsberry Posted January 31, 2015 Author Share Posted January 31, 2015 Iv been searching and I know exactly what I need, and it's potassium perchlorate and fine mesh dark Al to make a flash powder. I just cannot figure where to get the potassium perchlorate at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enanthate Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 If you live in Eu, kclo4 is not too easy to get by. Contact the guys at pyro-gear.co.uk, they might know more than I do. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmolsberry Posted January 31, 2015 Author Share Posted January 31, 2015 http://www.amateurpyro.com/forums/index.php?app=core&module=global§ion=reputation&do=add_rating&app_rate=forums&type=pid&type_id=139629&rating=1&secure_key=d0a3e840bbdf7a28327260960e1bad6c&post_return=139629Thank you for the reply, I will have to check out their website and I'm from the U.S. I will contact them and hopefully they can tell me were to get ahold of it. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmolsberry Posted January 31, 2015 Author Share Posted January 31, 2015 Okay so I have been reading around the forum more and more and trying to learn my stuff. And I came across someone who was saying the the people of this community and forum grow weary of people who first come on here looking to make flash. And the answer is obvious as to why people would be weary of a stranger coming on here asking how to make a high velocity binary explosive. Anyways. I'm Garrett, and I take great interest in all of this stuff. As long as it done with safety in mind. Iv been looking at tutorials and reading about oxidizers and fuels, I still have a long way to come with my knowledge as far as the regards of making my own explosive targets and flash powders in the future. Sorry for coming off on the wrong foot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric70 Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 gmolsberry, Please be careful with things that go boom. A couple years ago there was a bad accident in my neck of the woods with exploding targets and shrapnel. http://www.postbulletin.com/news/crime/utica-man-killed-in-bachelor-party-accident/article_c31e3ad2-710f-548c-8e71-0d0973c187a5.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 I don't think anyone is experienced and good enough to be free of risk while doing pyro. BUT beginners don't usually have the skill set required to minimise and mitigate the risk and hazards. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WonderBoy Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 (edited) gmo, Another reason, on top of several others already mentioned in other threads, that people are wary of providing you information is that you have obviously spent about zero time researching anything. Even a basic search would have answered your question: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=potassium+perchlorate A word of advice to have people to take you more seriously, take the time to search the forum, don't trust Youtube, and spell check your posts. WB Edited January 31, 2015 by WonderBoy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexpyro101 Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 Why not not just make more of the exploding target mix? Are you planning on shooting the flash powder or adding a small bag or something to the target mix? I definitely wouldn't recommend mixing these explosives together. Also anyone know why it's deemed safe to throw in ammonium nitrate, potassium perchlorate, aluminum, titanium sponge, and zirconium hyrdoxide into a plastic container and shake it around, but it would be crazy to do that with flash powder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WonderBoy Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 Uhh Alex/Hank... I think you have missed much of what has been posted. WB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jakenbake Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 I still wish I could make decent ash.....lol 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmolsberry Posted February 1, 2015 Author Share Posted February 1, 2015 Why not not just make more of the exploding target mix? Are you planning on shooting the flash powder or adding a small bag or something to the target mix? I definitely wouldn't recommend mixing these explosives together. Also anyone know why it's deemed safe to throw in ammonium nitrate, potassium perchlorate, aluminum, titanium sponge, and zirconium hyrdoxide into a plastic container and shake it around, but it would be crazy to do that with flash powder? GOOD LORD, i will not be mixing flash in a bag or shaking it. i plan on making single gram targets, i am too worried to make it in large quantities. I am aware of how unstable flash has the potential to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmolsberry Posted February 1, 2015 Author Share Posted February 1, 2015 gmo, Another reason, on top of several others already mentioned in other threads, that people are wary of providing you information is that you have obviously spent about zero time researching anything. Even a basic search would have answered your question: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=potassium+perchlorate A word of advice to have people to take you more seriously, take the time to search the forum, don't trust Youtube, and spell check your posts. WBThis is true, i should search more and read more. I was also asking about 70/30 because i was still yet to find out what it is exactly, the thread was just mentioning that mixing some 70/30 into tannerite can sensitize it so it can be used with lower velocity rounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enanthate Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 You must be the first american I've met who is willing to take the risk of ordering from outside the US.The post I made was assuming you were European. Feel free to contact them if you want, just saying.. I'm sure there is a safer option for you, from somewhere inside the US. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmolsberry Posted February 1, 2015 Author Share Posted February 1, 2015 You must be the first american I've met who is willing to take the risk of ordering from outside the US.The post I made was assuming you were European. Feel free to contact them if you want, just saying.. I'm sure there is a safer option for you, from somewhere inside the US.I am not going to make any orders outside of the US, i plan on only making orders inside the US Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlaMtnBkr Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 (edited) Why not not just make more of the exploding target mix? Are you planning on shooting the flash powder or adding a small bag or something to the target mix? I definitely wouldn't recommend mixing these explosives together. Also anyone know why it's deemed safe to throw in ammonium nitrate, potassium perchlorate, aluminum, titanium sponge, and zirconium hyrdoxide into a plastic container and shake it around, but it would be crazy to do that with flash powder? alexpyro101: Tannerite doesn't contain KClO4 and probably doesn't have any NH4KClO4 either because it isn't needed. Patents aren't always accurate in amounts or contents. Even if it did contain it, it would probably be such a small amount as to not be excessively dangerous. In certain extreme proportions chemicals don't readily release their energy because the oxygen balance is wrong. *Don't put flash in a mill!!!* Nothing in pyro is really "safe". Edited February 2, 2015 by FlaMtnBkr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 gmolsberry from what I read here every US supplier of chemicals is mentioned multiple times, with their product range findable on the site somewhere. Suppliers in several other countries are named. Personally I think ALL new forum members should spend some weeks reading the forum without posting so that they have a good feel for the style and detail of the content here and the style of the hobby. Learning from the good and bad experiences of others is the only way to attempt to be safe. The first mix most new starters want to make is flash powder, but one gram of fast flash will take your hand off leaving shredded tendons at the wrist, which tends to be unpopular with the wife / girlfriend and very popular with the surgeons who just see money signs. There are reasons why explosive targets cost money, because getting them right costs money. $100 on shop bought targets will cost you a LOT less than a pyro injury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmolsberry Posted February 2, 2015 Author Share Posted February 2, 2015 Tannerite doesn't contain KClO4 and probably doesn't have any NH4KClO4 either because it isn't needed. Patents aren't always accurate in amounts or contents. Even if it did contain it, it would probably be such a small amount as to not be excessively dangerous. I can mix perchlorate and German dark and put it in a mill safely in the right proportions. *Don't put flash in a mill!!!* Nothing in pyro is really "safe". Edit: why not just stick with AN based targets and pass on flash for now. And if you sensitize AN with flash for low velocity rounds you will be mixing a lot more than 1g at a time.Their are a few reasons why i am trying to find a way to sensitize it. One of the reasons is stupid, this i know. And that is to make exploding arrows. And the second is to i can make targets that will actual give a very loud feedback. I have yet to find any where that tells what i could do to make a AN based binary that is sensitive enough to go off from a .177 caliber pellet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmolsberry Posted February 2, 2015 Author Share Posted February 2, 2015 Tannerite doesn't contain KClO4 and probably doesn't have any NH4KClO4 either because it isn't needed. Patents aren't always accurate in amounts or contents. Even if it did contain it, it would probably be such a small amount as to not be excessively dangerous. I can mix perchlorate and German dark and put it in a mill safely in the right proportions. *Don't put flash in a mill!!!* Nothing in pyro is really "safe". Edit: why not just stick with AN based targets and pass on flash for now. And if you sensitize AN with flash for low velocity rounds you will be mixing a lot more than 1g at a time.I know tannerite us AN and Al. And oh yes i think i have been steered away from flash. Wait you said "perchlorate and german dark.." If im not mistaken, arent those the 2 that make up flash. i know their are different types of flash but what makes this one so stable that you can put it in a mill? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlaMtnBkr Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 (edited) I should have known someone would not know what I was saying and think that was ok. It is NOT stable enough to put in a mill!!! It is not stable enough to be screwing with when you don't know anything yet or know how to safely handle it. I will edit my post and I hope you do too, so that you completely forget you ever read those words. I was replying to Alex's question about why Tannerite is deemed "safe". That can only be done at ratios of oxidizer to fuel where the oxygen balance is so over or under oxidized as to not be flammable. At many/most ratios it is extremely powerful and will result in an explosion after only a few seconds in a mill. Do you really want something so sensitive as to ignite from a pellet? Something so powerful that a gram will rip your fingers off your hand? If it is sensitive enough for a pellet how do you know it won't be sensitive enough for a fly fart? You can't just have a stern lecture with it so it knows what it can or can't ignite from. Normal flash will not ignite from a pellet so there is no reason to even try. I hope that doesn't mean a pellet gun is all you can legally own. Nothing wrong with being young but you have to have the knowledge of how to safely handle this stuff that is much more complex than how to simply make flash. To have something that will ignite from a pellet you will need a devil's brew of chemicals that is unstable enough that the small amount of energy from a pellet is enough to cause ignition. Unstable enough that most pyros would dirty their shorts just looking at the chemicals sitting next to each other. Do yourself a favor and forget about stuff that explodes until you have a few years of experience and can fully understand the dangers and safety precautions needed to be messing with the stuff. We all have to start somewhere and extremely sensitive flash is the last thing you should mess with. Edited February 2, 2015 by FlaMtnBkr 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Into a clean mill you should only put single chemicals or the ingredients for simple BP if your law permits. Should you ever have milled chlorate then that jar and media is for chlorate comps ONLY, -it's improbable that you will ever clean the jar properly. It's very hazardous to attempt to mill metal powders -several incidents have happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmolsberry Posted February 4, 2015 Author Share Posted February 4, 2015 I should have known someone would not know what I was saying and think that was ok. It is NOT stable enough to put in a mill!!! It is not stable enough to be screwing with when you don't know anything yet or know how to safely handle it. I will edit my post and I hope you do too, so that you completely forget you ever read those words. I was replying to Alex's question about why Tannerite is deemed "safe". That can only be done at ratios of oxidizer to fuel where the oxygen balance is so over or under oxidized as to not be flammable. At many/most ratios it is extremely powerful and will result in an explosion after only a few seconds in a mill. Do you really want something so sensitive as to ignite from a pellet? Something so powerful that a gram will rip your fingers off your hand? If it is sensitive enough for a pellet how do you know it won't be sensitive enough for a fly fart? You can't just have a stern lecture with it so it knows what it can or can't ignite from. Normal flash will not ignite from a pellet so there is no reason to even try. I hope that doesn't mean a pellet gun is all you can legally own. Nothing wrong with being young but you have to have the knowledge of how to safely handle this stuff that is much more complex than how to simply make flash. To have something that will ignite from a pellet you will need a devil's brew of chemicals that is unstable enough that the small amount of energy from a pellet is enough to cause ignition. Unstable enough that most pyros would dirty their shorts just looking at the chemicals sitting next to each other. Do yourself a favor and forget about stuff that explodes until you have a few years of experience and can fully understand the dangers and safety precautions needed to be messing with the stuff. We all have to start somewhere and extremely sensitive flash is the last thing you should mess with.Oh no the pellet gun is just what i use for fun on the ranch since i cant go racking 30-30 rounds off as i please. we have neighbors and i dont trust taking the risk of ricocheting a 30-30 or .308 off into our pasture.. And the energy from my pellet rifle is just a hair under 30ft/lbs @50yds.. And coming to think about it.. That mix would be beyond unstable inorder to be set by the pellet.. Although the pellet, at that distance is moving probably 1200 fps.. It would still be iffy. And no trust me i never thought it was okay to put flash in a ball mill. NO WAY. Thats why it stuck out to me like a sore thumb when you said you could put the 2 ingredients that i know make up flash inside of a ball mill relatively safely in the right ratios.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparx88 Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 Just do as you have been asked to do. If you want to fit in and get respect it's a good time to start. I found that it's really easy to be shunned around here for less. And don't post any videos of your pyro work unless it's as good or better than the pro's or it won't be recognized. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadowcat1969 Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Thats why it stuck out to me like a sore thumb when you said you could put the 2 ingredients that i know make up flash inside of a ball mill relatively safely in the right ratios.. What he was saying is that in the "right ratios" (meaning ratios that will NOT result in a reactive mix) one can ball mill the two ingredients together. But one learns the "right ratios" with experience. However, imho, there really isn't much reason to do so, even with the correct knowledge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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