fight fire with fire Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 Hi, i'm quite new to pyro i was just wondering were all you guys get your milling media and ball mill stuff. Inoxia have ceramic media i need lead, by the way they have to be British. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aikimike999 Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 Try your local fishing shop, that's where I got mine from. Regards, Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fight fire with fire Posted February 15, 2007 Author Share Posted February 15, 2007 I think i'll use scuba lead like siffup said, there is this guy whos selling 1/2lb-1lb weights, i'll probally get them. They come in big shafts do i have to saw them up or melt them? Or will it be fine to use a couple? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cplmac Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 The lead media I use is hardened with Antimony. Not sure if "soft" lead has the antimony. I think without the antimony your balls would wear faster and really discolor your comps. The lead antimony balls I use color my comp abit even though they are hardened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pudidotdk Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 I also want to make a ball mill, I found some lead marbles without antimony so they're soft. I Shook it with sugar just to simulate, and the suger turned white-grey which isn't good. I have trying to put a few of them in a jar with a water/cuppersulphate solution but that didn't do much. (only a THIN!! layer of cupper, you can hardly see it and it's not very even). Anyone got an idea on how to harden it? I don't have acces to antimony, and melting the lead in ball-shapes will be quite difficult for me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vongeetch Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 Why can't you use ceramic ? I've been using Alumina ceramic for a few years now. I hav'nt had any problems with it and they don't wear down as fast as lead w/antimony. I use it to mill my BP and meal powders.=-vongeetch-- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frozentech Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 Why can't you use ceramic ? I've been using Alumina ceramic for a few years now. I hav'nt had any problems with it and they don't wear down as fast as lead w/antimony. I use it to mill my BP and meal powders.=-vongeetch--Ask Steve Baron ( aka 'the Charcoal Guy' ) about using ceramic to mill BP. The day his mill exploded, he had done it 'lot's of times' before too. Too much uncertainty, and at least one definite incident with ceramic, vice no known case of lead or brass caused explosions.... hmmm. Like the pregnant teenage girl said to her doctor "But I done it lots of times before and nothin' happened". Ceramic is highly regarded for airfloat milling pure chemicals, however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewest Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 and melting the lead in ball-shapes will be quite difficult for me... Actually, ball shaped is not the most efficient. Cylinders would have more surface area in contact at any one time so that's actually the best shape. Preferably, the same length as outside diameter, ex. 1/2" Long x 1/2" OD You can pour melted lead down copper or brass tubes then cut the tubes into smaller pieces. Or as an alternative, drill some holes in a slab of plaster of paris and cast the lead that way? It's an idea I was talking with some people about today but not sure if it would work. I don't know if the hot lead would melt or crack the plaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vongeetch Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 Froentech, I do agree with you. We have discussed this subject over at Passfire. I should of noted that my mill is also 75 feet away from anybody. Brass rod could also be cut down to desired lenght and deburr the ends. You also might try Pyrocreations,. They are in the supplier review section. They do carry what your looking for, but their site did'nt say if they ship internationally. you could give them a call or email. Skylighter also ships internationally, but I did'nt see any media. Hope that helps.--vongeetch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pudidotdk Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 and melting the lead in ball-shapes will be quite difficult for me...Actually, ball shaped is not the most efficient. Cylinders would have more surface area in contact at any one time so that's actually the best shape. Preferably, the same length as outside diameter, ex. 1/2" Long x 1/2" OD You can pour melted lead down copper or brass tubes then cut the tubes into smaller pieces. Or as an alternative, drill some holes in a slab of plaster of paris and cast the lead that way? It's an idea I was talking with some people about today but not sure if it would work. I don't know if the hot lead would melt or crack the plaster. Casting the lead in plaster of paris doesn't make the lead harder Although I will consider the tube, do you think Aluminium tube might work? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frozentech Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 Froentech, I do agree with you. We have discussed this subject over at Passfire. I should of noted that my mill is also 75 feet away from anybody. Brass rod could also be cut down to desired lenght and deburr the ends. Yeah I am on Passfire as well, some people do use ceramic for BP, some don't. I usually go on the theory that energetic materials carry enough risk to work with that I don't want to add to the potential for trouble, is all. Having your mill set up remotely is a good thing. Mine usually runs in a utility shed, but I still don't want to lose the shed ! I do have about 20 lb of ceramic, and some more new Coorstek media on the way, but really, I wanted that for milling Ammonium Perchlorate in particular, since I don't want brass to contact that. I have some clumpy Ba(NO3)2 that needs to be pulverized too. For BP milling, I do use brass rod. I have 3/4" hexagon brass bar stock that I cut into 3/4 - 1 inch long chunks. It works magnificently. My best guess is that it cut my milling time down 25% for the same quality compared to .50 lead balls. For deburring it, just toss the cut brass rod in the mill and run it for 3 hours or so. It will be practically polished by tumbling on itself. Damn... I hope this post made sense... I probably shouldn't write when I take a percocet ! ( damn shoulder and neck is killing me) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cplmac Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 I bought my lead/antimony media from pyrocreations, it's expensive but pretty good. I bought two bags of the half inch balls. My slightly discolored perch has never been a problem, and I milled it for 72 hours. If you decide to melt the lead down, make sure you are certain it does not contain any antimony. Usually lead antimony is processed with arsenic, and when you melt it it gives off poisonous arsenic gas. Not sure how much or how dangerous it is, but it is something you should be aware of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oriansbelt Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 Well what he was asking was if there was a way to harden non-antimony lead so arsenic vapors shouldn't be a problem. To the question I would say yes, you might be able to increase the hardness by adding another type of metal other than antimony. I would try tin since it is the most common alloying element besides antimony but I'm not sure if that is for hardness or another property. Other than that titanium, carbon, vanadium, molybdonium *might* be good ones to try but the those are just guesses and the copper tube idea would be better than trying those but if you want to experiment thats what I would do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewest Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 Casting the lead in plaster of paris doesn't make the lead harder I know that, but what I was saying is that it might be an alternative way to cast it once you figure out how to get the Antimony mixed in. Casting it in balls is a bitch. Cylinders would be easier to cast and that's a more ideal shape for grinding media anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vongeetch Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 Wolter Pyro Tools ships internationally. They sell 5lb. lead bars with 6% antimony for $16.00 each plus shipping . Page 3 of the supplier review. They also sell casting molds if you want to make your own media.--vongeetch-- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbles Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 If you look at some bullet casting sites, they have very high conc Antimony lead bars, like 24%. Antimony doesn't dissolve in lead very well. It requires much higher temps than the MP of lead. The very high conc Sb lead is meant to be smelted with pure lead so it dissolves easier. If you can find linotype lead, it already has the 5-6% we want. Linotype is all over ebay for reloading bullets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fight fire with fire Posted February 16, 2007 Author Share Posted February 16, 2007 Thanks yoyu guys. And casting lead into balls isn't that hard if you have a 30ftish drop. If you drop the molten lead down through the air the air pressure is equal on all sides of it so it forms a sphere. Then at the bottom you need a pit of sand to catch the lead. regards Henry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cplmac Posted February 17, 2007 Share Posted February 17, 2007 i use about 200 cal.15 lead shot(dont know, if they contain antimony If you are specifically using lead shot for shot gun shells, chances are it has the antimony and aresenic. My #8 lead shot which is very small does. I like the idea of using a long drop, sounds like a cool little experiment to try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pudidotdk Posted February 22, 2007 Share Posted February 22, 2007 Can copper/brass and lead be melted together and casted i a copper or brass tube and be used. Or can I simply use Brass or copper rod and cut it to pieces? Sorry for bad explaining im in a hurry..! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
50caliber Posted February 22, 2007 Share Posted February 22, 2007 Can copper/brass and lead be melted together and casted i a copper or brass tube and be used. Or can I simply use Brass or copper rod and cut it to pieces? Sorry for bad explaining im in a hurry..! I'm not sure if you can melt them together, but you can cut your brass or copper tubes and fill them with lead. I see no reason way copper or brass rod wouldn't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewest Posted February 22, 2007 Share Posted February 22, 2007 You can cut copper or brass rods and use those, it's just that lead weights more than those two so it's a more efficient crushing media. Isn't lead cheaper that copper or brass as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pudidotdk Posted February 22, 2007 Share Posted February 22, 2007 As I wrote before: >,< Lead is too dang soft! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pretty green flame Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 As I wrote before: >,< Lead is too dang soft! I'd go with brass for my milling media of choice. It's supposedly non spark, hard wearing and lasts a life time. In my ball mill i use brass rods cut to 16cm (lenght of milling barrel), they are heavy as hell and will pulverize hard charcoals in no time. The theory behind this is that the rods roll over each other so they have a much larger surface area for crushing. I mostly use it only for milling inert stuff (charcoals and mixes without oxidisers), I don't trust it on being completly sparkless so i don't mill BP with it, i use lead fishing weights for that (been using the same ones for 3 years with minimal wear) Hope this helps a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frozentech Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 Can copper/brass and lead be melted together and casted i a copper or brass tube and be used. Or can I simply use Brass or copper rod and cut it to pieces? Sorry for bad explaining im in a hurry..! Brass works just fine for milling most anything. I use 3/4" hex brass bar stock cut into 3/4" long chunks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwezxc12 Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 I've used these before for some milling jobs. I buy them from MidwayUSA, a reloading supply company. They're good for small batches (200-300g) and they're fully copper plated - no exposed lead: http://i19.tinypic.com/34oty0n.jpg They're .50 cal, bullet weight is 335 grains (21.7g). 100 of them fill a 3lb. tumbler jar 1/2 way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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