pyrovinny Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 Hi ive been looking into a shell wrapping device. ive got an idea in my head using a bike cycle rim adn cutting out all the spokes so just the rim is left anD assembling it from there on a set of rollers..... The question is what motor spins at 1 to 3 rpm??? I assuming its a worm gear set up of sorts but where is a good place to start looking for a small motor/worm gear? Ive seen a few DIY vids of how they are set up but no parts list lol hope some one can help me!!! thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deer Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 People often use car wind-shield wiper motors for various slow drive purposes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogeryermaw Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 McMaster Carr has about everything...almost. but they do have reduction gears. also try grainger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 Motors from mobility scooters and electric wheelchairs tend to run nice and slowly for the purpose, but may need their own controller. Do some calculations and see what you really need, If you intend to use a roller on the outside to drive a cycle rim then you will need to rotate the rim at say 10 - 30 rpm so the drive could need to rotate at 100 to 300 RPM Windscreen wiper motors can be slow, maybe too slow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pyrovinny Posted June 16, 2015 Author Share Posted June 16, 2015 yes i do intend to use a roller on the out side of the cycle rim and ok so wind whield motors will spin that slow i take it? thank you for all the help !! greatly appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 IMO a wiper motor may spin too slowly. Maybe an ATX power supply will offer you some supply alternatives. Make sure that it always stops with the tape reel at the bottom or the water will fall out (or use a big sponge!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 I'd want the wheel rim to do lots of RPM, so you'd need "lots" x the diameter ratio of the wheels to get the wheel rim turning at a worth while speed. You need the machine to be both faster and better than hand pasting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncrichie Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 I've been researching this also. Several youtube videos unveil the following: #1- wheel rim rotation 36 rpm, axis rotation of shell 2.5 rpm#2- wheel rim rotation 100 rpm, axis rotation of shell 8 rpm#3- wheel rim rotation 52 rpm, axis rotation of shell 3.5 rpm I've also seen other videos where the axis speed varies depending on the location of the pasting on the shell. It will take a lot of experimenting but should be a fun winter project. Good luck PS, all your motor needs are available on e-bay. for axis rotation look up 12 volt dc gear reduction motors. As others have mentioned your rim motor will depend on motor rpms and drive wheel size as well as diameter of the wheel rim. Keep us filled in on your progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schroedinger Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 (edited) Engines designed for spit roasts or kebab often turn in ranges of 1-3 rpm. Edited June 17, 2015 by schroedinger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 Start designing the mechanism before you buy anything. The aim of this machine is to be better and quicker than hand pasting. IMO your motor may need to turn at more like 1000RPM so that the rim does 50 - 100 rpm. Maybe your one motor will drive both the rim rotation AND the spindle rotation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncrichie Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 Start designing the mechanism before you buy anything. The aim of this machine is to be better and quicker than hand pasting. IMO your motor may need to turn at more like 1000RPM so that the rim does 50 - 100 rpm. Maybe your one motor will drive both the rim rotation AND the spindle rotation. 800-1000rpm is the range of the motor I'll most likely be using. I just remembered something I wanted to mention. You titled this "Low Budget", there is going to be a lot of experimenting involved and it will more than likely exceed your budget so be prepared. If you weld that's a big plus along with general mechanical ability. Also familiarity with electrical and electronic components will go along way. Just remember if your using water instead of glue in your reservoir its going to be splattering all over the place and you want to keep water out of your motors and connections so be careful. A GFI outlet will be your friend through your adventures. Have fun. Kurt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pyrovinny Posted June 17, 2015 Author Share Posted June 17, 2015 thanks for the feed back and yes i do know how to weld and im a hvac (Heating ventilation and air conditioning/ refrigeration) tech by trade so i do know a good am mount on wiring i will keep you guys informed on my progress. Im trying to get away from hand pasting lol All i bought so far is a 5 rmp dc motor form amazon for 12 bucks i cant beat that!! I got a few ac fan motors laying around so ill try with one of them for turning the rim. Ill be shure to post pics of my build along the way after the fourth and my bros grad party! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 I'd suggest that low volts is a safer way to go use a 12v motor on maybe 6 - 10v as speed control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Col Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 (edited) The wheel speed is fixed, the shell rotation motor needs to be variable speed.The shell size and tape width dictates the shell rotation speed. If you have a big ballmill you can make it dual purpose by using motor and shafts/bearings to drive the wheel of the shell pasting machine. Think of it as a shell pasting attachment. Edited June 27, 2015 by Col 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 Remember that in one turn of the rim your shell will need to rotate about 1/4 of the width of the pasting tape at it's perimeter. Also there are limits to the width of pasting tape that can be applied smoothly to a sphere - you don't want the tape to ripple. If you are stuck with 2" tape then a tape slitter will be an essential product too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schroedinger Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 If you got a fireworking.com accounr, there are plans for a hand crancked pasting machine. It can be used with an motor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Col Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 If you have a bandsaw you can build a hand-cranked wood geared pasting machine pretty cheap (~$100). It has a full sized 220m tape roll carrier and a glue box that can apply real glue to both sides of a slitted plain kraft tape or just water to standard gummed tape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 I wonder whether one could use a single motor with pulley to drive a really LONG belt running round both the rim and a pulley on the ball rotator. A well made long splice would enable the belt to be made from a piece of rope. Turns ratio to be set by the pulley diameter ratios. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Col Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 Using 2 motors would be cheaper. As the rim (tape wheel) runs at the higher speed you`ll need pulleys larger than the rim to provide the reduction for the shell rotation. Typically in the range of 20:1 - 40:1, a worm gear reduction and a flexible driveshaft is an option but still more expensive than using a small high torque gearmotor for the shell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 The advantage of using a belt is that it keeps the motor away from the wet bits! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
froggyb99 Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 would it be good to use a stepper motor for the ball rotation so you could adjust the speed with the different sizes of shells and the different angle of the shell? Ive never used a stepper motor before so would anyone know if this would be easily programmable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 A nice meaty stepper motor is wonderful as a controllable speed rotator, but the first thing to realise is that all electrics need to be dry, so once you put a motor near the rotating water/glue reservoir you do need to work out how to keep it freely rotating AND dry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Col Posted July 28, 2015 Share Posted July 28, 2015 (edited) The advantage of using a belt is that it keeps the motor away from the wet bits!If you design the gluebox right there arent any wet bits, dry tape goes in and tape with a very thin film of glue on both sides comes out A single belt driving pulleys would be pretty daunting from a design point of view. If you consider a 20" rim diameter as the driving pulley, the shell pulley will need to be at least 23x as large to provide the necessary gearing reduction. Here`s my gluebox design with dimensions in case anyone needs one, costs about a fiver to make. The tape tension and glue film thickness can be adjusted independantly via the two sliding acrylic sections. https://youtu.be/KW4nMvsi3_k Edited July 28, 2015 by Col 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TYRONEEZEKIEL Posted July 28, 2015 Share Posted July 28, 2015 Try talking to user on here name ZMURO. He made a pretty slick shell paster himself. It functions very similar to the chinese pasting machines. I hope he sees this and can shed light on the construction of one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tradami Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 You can use this calculator to help determine what type of reduction you need to get the RPM you want to achieve. http://www.blocklayer.com/pulley-belteng.aspx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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